The Armenian-Azerbaijani conflict

That land is worthless, its only hills and only creates headaches as the legal basis is shaky especially when both parties have agreed to border demarcation based around soviet borders. The reasoning for taking the land initially doesn't exist anymore as Armenia has agreed to give back the land it was occupying and agreed to border demarcations based on Soviet borders that they were resisting initially. The last element people mention is Zangezur, but taking Zangezur will bring a confrontation with Iran b/c it cuts off their access to the north via armenia.
But still for some reason the Azeris have been occupying the points on the map I posted above. I don't know why. They just barged in after the 2020 war and never left. They built outposts and there's been various videos of Armenian and Azeri patrols meeting and exchanging words. Well...not always kind words...lol but still. You know.
 
But still for some reason the Azeris have been occupying the points on the map I posted above. I don't know why. They just barged in after the 2020 war and never left. They built outposts and there's been various videos of Armenian and Azeri patrols meeting and exchanging words. Well...not always kind words...lol but still. You know.

Do you know why those areas were taken?

After the war ended, Armenians withdrew from the Karabakh border areas but not many people know that even excluding exclaves, there are areas for example in the north that Armenian troops took in the 90s. When the 2020 war ended, they agreed to leave Karabakh, but they did not agree to leave those other areas on the border, when talks of demarcation started they said, lets make the border based on "Lines of Control" instead of the Soviet Border based on Alma Ata, which obviously favored them as they held more land outside of Alma Ata.

So Azerbaijan responded by taking areas in other parts, and said ok, you still want to do borders based on "Lines of Control"? After this, the Armenians changed their minds and no longer wanted to do borders based on Lines of Control and said they want it to be based on Alma Ata, Azerbaijan said ok, but we start demarcation at the areas that you took, this went on for a while until in 2024, Armenia returned 4 villages that were part of the Qazax District of Azerbaijan, what previously Armenia controlled as part of its Tavush province. This if you remember led to some protests in Armenia from the Irredentists. But that return of the 4 villages. Bağanis Ayrum, Aşağı Əskipara, Xeyrimli, and Qızılhacılı formed the basis for demarcation.

So after that return there have been several developments including the ratification by both countries of the demarcation. This happened in around late October/early November 2024.



After this, there was a meeting that took place in January 2025



That meeting was 2 weeks back, we should hopefully see more results soon on where the next point of demarcation will be.

I'd say 80-90% of the issues are solved, but that last 10-20% is the hardest. B/c it requires the issue of exclaves to be solved, whether they should exchange them or whatever mechanism is assigned to them. Personally I think an exchange works best, as there is less drama but its harder to do legally, b/c any exchange of territory requires a constitutional approval/change. which itself is complicated for Armenia domestically for various reasons.
 
Do you know why those areas were taken?

After the war ended, Armenians withdrew from the Karabakh border areas but not many people know that even excluding exclaves, there are areas for example in the north that Armenian troops took in the 90s. When the 2020 war ended, they agreed to leave Karabakh, but they did not agree to leave those other areas on the border, when talks of demarcation started they said, lets make the border based on "Lines of Control" instead of the Soviet Border based on Alma Ata, which obviously favored them as they held more land outside of Alma Ata.

So Azerbaijan responded by taking areas in other parts, and said ok, you still want to do borders based on "Lines of Control"? After this, the Armenians changed their minds and no longer wanted to do borders based on Lines of Control and said they want it to be based on Alma Ata, Azerbaijan said ok, but we start demarcation at the areas that you took, this went on for a while until in 2024, Armenia returned 4 villages that were part of the Qazax District of Azerbaijan, what previously Armenia controlled as part of its Tavush province. This if you remember led to some protests in Armenia from the Irredentists. But that return of the 4 villages. Bağanis Ayrum, Aşağı Əskipara, Xeyrimli, and Qızılhacılı formed the basis for demarcation.

So after that return there have been several developments including the ratification by both countries of the demarcation. This happened in around late October/early November 2024.



After this, there was a meeting that took place in January 2025



That meeting was 2 weeks back, we should hopefully see more results soon on where the next point of demarcation will be.

I'd say 80-90% of the issues are solved, but that last 10-20% is the hardest. B/c it requires the issue of exclaves to be solved, whether they should exchange them or whatever mechanism is assigned to them. Personally I think an exchange works best, as there is less drama but its harder to do legally, b/c any exchange of territory requires a constitutional approval/change. which itself is complicated for Armenia domestically for various reasons.
The weirdest thing is seeing Pashinyan trying to play macho and then asking for peace and then trying to play macho again and then asking for agreements again and then...again and again. It's just hilarious. The Armenian Armed Forces have been smashed to the point were they can barely defend their ground now.
 
The weirdest thing is seeing Pashinyan trying to play macho and then asking for peace and then trying to play macho again and then asking for agreements again and then...again and again. It's just hilarious. The Armenian Armed Forces have been smashed to the point were they can barely defend their ground now.

Pashinyan from 2018/2019 and Pashinyan from 2024/2025 are night and day.

Dude went from Karabakh is Armenia Period! and appointed a guy as defense minister that had a new doctrine(Tonoyan Doctrine) with "New Wars for New Lands", as a "deterrence"

to

"Armenian is 29,743 square kilometers" no more no less. lol and correcting someone who rounded up to 29,800.

"Pashinyan: 29,800 sq. km. is rounded number, actual area of Armenia is little smaller"


1738086836244.png
 
Pashinyan from 2018/2019 and Pashinyan from 2024/2025 are night and day.

Dude went from Karabakh is Armenia Period! and appointed a guy as defense minister that had a new doctrine(Tonoyan Doctrine) with "New Wars for New Lands", as a "deterrence"

to

"Armenian is 29,743 square kilometers" no more no less. lol and correcting someone who rounded up to 29,800.

"Pashinyan: 29,800 sq. km. is rounded number, actual area of Armenia is little smaller"


View attachment 97581
Back then I used to tell my Armenian friend that Pashinyan would be happy to give all Armenia and keep Yerevan as a city-State. I kept telling him I wouldn't be surprised if he pulled the entire army back to protect Yerevan. It certainly looked like that's what he did with the Su-30s
 
yes but no air to air package.
That's the kind of nonsense the Greek government often does. Like buy tanks,but not enough ammunition,buy new aircraft and helicopters without a good FOS package,order weapons from a company that takes too long to deliver them and we do nothing etc.
 
That's the kind of nonsense the Greek government often does. Like buy tanks,but not enough ammunition,buy new aircraft and helicopters without a good FOS package,order weapons from a company that takes too long to deliver them and we do nothing etc.

Serz thought the Aircraft came with Weapons for free as compliment like floor mats in Car at the dealership. lol
 
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why is this in the "Turkish Affairs" section? this thread should be in a neutral section since Turkey is not formally a party to this conflict. @Waz
 
why is this in the "Turkish Affairs" section? this thread should be in a neutral section since Turkey is not formally a party to this conflict. @Waz

Turkey has defense pact with Azeribaijan hence they are party to this conflict. A war on Azeribaijan means a war on Turkey
 
Turkey has defense pact with Azeribaijan hence they are party to this conflict. A war on Azeribaijan means a war on Turkey
Turkey has never been an active participant in any of Azerbaijan's invasions and wars against Armenia in the past that I am aware of, unless we include the Armenian Genocide
 
Turkey has never been an active participant in any of Azerbaijan's invasions and wars against Armenia in the past that I am aware of, unless we include the Armenian Genocide

Turkey were not technically an official party to the Qarabakh conflict but they supplied weapons and even mercenaries. But proper Azeribaijan is Turkey´s concern due to their defense treaty
 

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