WARSIDT
Registered Member
I'm criticizing MMM-E's ultranationalistic simple-minded unrealistic version of Turkey where everything is perfect. To a normal person and I have to assume that you're a normal person,I can say that our Navy has been left behind and although the ND government of 2019 made a good start in 2020-2021,they slowed down in 2022 and completely fucked it up from 2023 to now.
For example: We were supposed to buy 6 FREMM from France in 2009,the economic crisis started,the Germans said no,we had no money for a decade,most navy projects that were underway were slowly completed,the shipyards abandoned,the Armed Forces neglected etc.
In 2019-2020 we had the Navy ask for:
The government granted 5,5 billion euros for that. However,that wasn't enough because the Navy had reached a point that we had to:
- Four new frigates
- Interim solution
- Upgrade of the 4 MEKO 200HN frigates
The MEKO upgrade itself turned into a joke as it was being cancelled again and again for years.
- Replace/retire the 9 Kortenaer frigates
- Replace/retire the 4 obsolete Type 209 submarines(specifically the Glavkos and Poseidon class)
- Maybe retire 5 or all 8 of the Combattante FAC
So we start with 3+1 FDI HN. We know we need new ships. They don't buy the option. They decide to buy the option after it expires. So we're talking about 4 FDI HN frigates with a proposal from the French for an additional 3 to be built in Greece.
Then come the Italians and offer us the FREMM Bergamini that will be retired when Italy starts receiving the FREMM EVO. For start,we want the first two and then possibly the next two. The Navy and government also finally decided to upgrade the MEKO. They also want to upgrade the 4 Type 214(Papanikolis class)submarines and the 7 Super Vita FAC.
Now,I don't know what they want to order,but they are asking for new submarines that will have the capability to carry cruise missiles.
As you can see,our Navy isn't in the best position,but the Turkish Navy too is also far from the superpower position MMM-E talks about. You only have 1 ISTIF class now and the TF-2000 will take some time to be built. As for the number of cells and all that,we'll see. There's a lot of boasting from the Turkish side,but unless you actually see it happening with full and functional cells,that's just big talk.
The problem is our dumb leaders wasted time here,not knowing if they want to buy corvettes as well or get free LCS from the Americans. Then they imagined Constellation frigates,then EPC corvettes in the far future,one day they want 32 Aster-30 on the FDI,the next day 24 Aster-30 and 8 MdCN.
Hopefully,the Navy leadership will pressure them to take serious measures. BUT we did get and are still getting Exocet Block 3c on the ships,not just "AM39 Exocet" that MMM-E talks about.
Yes, I had followed many of the things you mentioned, but I also stopped following because I no longer understand what Greece is trying to do. You are a member of the EU, a member of NATO, and you are not really excluded by the West like Türkiye is. When I think about this, I say, “If they really wanted to build a ship, they could get systems and technology transfers from everywhere.” But the result? Buying ready-made and second-hand ships from other countries.
I gave the TCG Anadolu task force as a future example. As far as I remember right now, the İstif-class more specifically the TCG İstanbul still does not have the Quadpack system. It will probably be updated soon; for now, while it is still in the navy’s hands, it is essentially in a phase of naval testing and experience-gaining. From what we can see right now, a Greece and Türkiye conflict is not close, and that’s why I gave an example from the future for something that could happen later because if we think 4 or 5 years ahead, at least 1 or 2 TF-2000s will be in the water, or 1 will be launched and, like the TCG İstanbul, will be in testing and experience gaining with the navy. And the İstif-class ships will have the Quadpack VLS system.
If we really look at it, it’s very obvious that this will not happen anyway. I mean, what do you expect from a war scenario drawn up in two minutes on a forum? As I said, just by looking at the technical data, I said that even in the future, the Greek navy alone would have a very hard time having the capability to saturate just with its navy. And even with simple reasoning, the TCG Anadolu has no business in the Aegean anyway.
Let’s hope no conflict breaks out.



















