Turkish UAV/UCAV Projects

[falcon34]

This is nearly a TB-2 size drone so the cost difference isn't just in the mere few thousands but in the hundreds of thousands.

He said 1/50th of the price of them system with similar ranges, tomahawks is about $3M-4M which means it's price tag is 60k-80k

 

[hyperman]

No it can't, look carefully. IRST is literally mounted on the (relatively) small radome.

View attachment 185706

Most of IRST unit is underneath the radome.

View attachment 185705

It eats up the space where radar array is supposed to be.

The current sensor config for KE is either AESA + EOTS or EOTS + IRST. Not all three at once.

Look at KAAN's IRST placement. It is behind the radome.

View attachment 185707

I'm sure you know more more than the Baykar engineers, and something like a modification of the nose, its couldn't possibly be done. And we should ignore any possibility of there being a 3 sensor configuration like the KAAN. lol

 

[hyperman]

While the specs are impressive the cost of this thing might be way too high for a kamakazi drone

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We don't know what the cost it.

It could be cheaper than a TB2, and the TB2 was around $2 million production cost, this is likely cheaper as it doesn't use the expensive CATS, but something cheaper, and they likely removed more expensive things and made things cheaper as well.

Storm Shadow missiles cost $3 million dollars, should no country use them?

AIM-120 costs $1.5 million dollars, should no plane shoot them?

Patriot missile interceptors cost $5 million.

PrSM costs $3 million dollars, should it not be used?

We also don't know how much the target costs, and how important it is to hit.

 

[MMM-E]

AZAP kamikaze Drone for cheaper ops as like Iranian Shahed-136


Range of 500 km
Warhead of 50 kg
fully autonomous flight
This is man-in-the-loop mode
Pre-programmed GPS coordinates guide the drone directly to the target
Anti-jamming GPS antenna to improve reliability in contested environments.
Optical seeker helps with terminal guidance or target acquisition.

Thanks to its radar cross-section and composite body, it is a product with a very low probability of being detected by Radars


If needed in a War , there are many companies in Türkiye that can produce kamikaze Drones, TAI, BAYKAR, ROBIT, LENTATEK, TITRA, SOLID AERO ,MKE, ROKETSAN ( 60-80-100-200-350-500-700-900-2.000+ km )

 

[T80UD]

Storm Shadow missiles cost $3 million dollars, should no country use them?

AIM-120 costs $1.5 million dollars, should no plane shoot them?

Patriot missile interceptors cost $5 million.

PrSM costs $3 million dollars, should it not be used?

We also don't know how much the target costs, and how important it is to hit.

Apples to oranges.

Storm Shadow is expensive but also can get through Air defenses better then the K2.

For the PrSM Again same as the storm Shadow expensive system that can get through air defenses.

As for the patriot or the AMRAAM it doesn't make sense to use them as an example.

Something like the K2 will likely be even easier to intercept then a shahed due to its larger RCS so you can see problem of costly system.

 

[MMM-E]

Storm Shadow is expensive but also can get through Air defenses better then the K2.

K-2 can be equipped with a jammer to paralyze enemy Radars for SEAD mission

and to produce 10 K-2 kamikaze Drones for swarm attack in price of 1 STORM SHADOW Cruise Missile

• Kamikaze/Direct Attack: E/O Camera for precision hits
• Electronic Attack/Jammer: Blinds or disrupts AD Radars
• Decoy Mode: to mimic as 10 Fighters (F-16, F-35, KAAN), forcing AD systems to activate and waste missiles

also K-2 with range of 2.000+ km reaches deep into Iran and establishes a balance against Shahed-136 Drone

 

[hyperman]

Apples to oranges.

Storm Shadow is expensive but also can get through Air defenses better then the K2.

For the PrSM Again same as the storm Shadow expensive system that can get through air defenses.

As for the patriot or the AMRAAM it doesn't make sense to use them as an example.

Something like the K2 will likely be even easier to intercept then a shahed due to its larger RCS so you can see problem of costly system.

Wow, you seem to have it all figured out, Baykar engineers wasted all that effort for nothing. lol

There is no indication that the Storm Shadow can get through better. These things are case dependent. This drone has AI and and coordinate and think, unlike the missile. It can carry out munitions, whether air to air or air to surface, it can carry jammers, can the storm shadow do all this?

The AMRAAM and Patriot was mentioned b/c it costs something to shoot down a target. Yet if the cost to shoot an AMRAAM can be justified, then why can the Drone not be justified.

Don't think that just b/c the Shahed costs $35,000 that no other price point for a strike platform can be justified.

We are literally seeing Ukraine use TB2 sized drones as Kamikazi drones, flown DEEP into Russia to great effect. THIS is why Baykar pursued a similar project in the first place, the only thing they have improved on is using their breakthroughs on swarms and AI from the Kizilelma project and integrating it into this TB2 sized drone.

 

[kimjongun]

K-2 can be equipped with a jammer to paralyze enemy Radars for SEAD mission

and to produce 10 K-2 kamikaze Drones for swarm attack in price of 1 STORM SHADOW Cruise Missile

• Kamikaze/Direct Attack: E/O Camera for precision hits
• Electronic Attack/Jammer: Blinds or disrupts AD Radars
• Decoy Mode: to mimic as 10 Fighters (F-16, F-35, KAAN), forcing AD systems to activate and waste missiles

also K-2 with range of 2.000+ km reaches deep into Iran and establishes a balance against Shahed-136 Drone

yeah keep adding add ones lol
This is a slow and big drone not suitable for LM operations , it would be better to use a cruise missile then this .

 

[Afif]

I'm sure you know more more than the Baykar engineers,

No I don't.

and something like a modification of the nose, its couldn't possibly be done.

Such modification might be possible. But PT5 said to be production representative. And no such modification and rearrangement is visible.

And we should ignore any possibility of there being a 3 sensor configuration like the KAAN. lol

No, you shouldn't ignore it at all. But this is moving the goal post. Clearly I wasn't talking about infinite future possibilities. Baykar might come up with 2 engine KE for all intent & purposes if they want. But the point is, current config doesn't allow it to carry all three sensors at once. That's all I said.

 

[CallSignMaverick]

It doesn't require a launch platform. It can take off from any road that's smooth enough. Remember, in the Iran-US & Israel conflict, launch platforms are the primary targets.

RATO take-off still remains the safest bet, why even need a road. Shaheds are launched from mobile trucks or basic stands but use RATO boosters, that are pretty low cost.

It can dive towards the target with its payload, but its primary purpose is to release the explosive payload from a distance and return. This tactic makes interception quite difficult.

Doesn't TB-2 do this already, albeit kamikaze role? Maybe it costs more.

 

[hyperman]

This is a slow and big drone not suitable for LM operations ,

Do you remember the polemics against the TB2? they mocked it as a useless flying cessna. how did that turn out?

We have TB2 sized drones being used RIGHT NOW, in Ukraine.

 

[GoatsMilk]

"Isn't their large size and cumbersome nature contrary to the kamikaze logic?" you might ask. Let me answer, if you'll allow me.

At first glance it might seem so, but it's not. This is actually a dangerous kamikaze drone. It's dangerous for three reasons:

1- It doesn't require a launch platform. It can take off from any road that's smooth enough. Remember, in the Iran-US & Israel conflict, launch platforms are the primary targets.

2- It can dive towards the target with its payload, but its primary purpose is to release the explosive payload from a distance and return. This tactic makes interception quite difficult.

3- It can operate using AI-powered swarm logic. This is not the case with the Shahid-type drones used by Iran. Therefore, its attack patterns adapt to the situation. Consequently, the attack patterns of this swarm are not easily predictable.

Seems like a drone that was designed to target the market between cheap suicide drone and more expensive tactical drone like the TB2.

 

[GoatsMilk]

AZAP kamikaze Drone for cheaper ops as like Iranian Shahed-136


Range of 500 km
Warhead of 50 kg
fully autonomous flight
This is man-in-the-loop mode
Pre-programmed GPS coordinates guide the drone directly to the target
Anti-jamming GPS antenna to improve reliability in contested environments.
Optical seeker helps with terminal guidance or target acquisition.

Thanks to its radar cross-section and composite body, it is a product with a very low probability of being detected by Radars
View attachment 185766

If needed in a War , there are many companies in Türkiye that can produce kamikaze Drones, TAI, BAYKAR, ROBIT, LENTATEK, TITRA, SOLID AERO ,MKE, ROKETSAN ( 60-80-100-200-350-500-700-900-2.000+ km )

To add to my previous point, there is loads of Turkish companies producing cheap suicide drones including baykar themselves, this new k2 drone seems to target the market gap between a suicide drone and the TB2.

It can be used as a suicide drone, but it can also function somewhat as a TB2. So price is obviously going to decide whether this is a winner or a loser moving forward.

 

[hyperman]

Haluk Bayraktar:

The K2 kamikaze drone costs approximately 1/50 as much as conventional military guided munitions with comparable range!

It offers much faster mass production capabilities and higher production capacity compared to similar systems...

It’s a kamikaze system, but it’s not actually a single-use platform...It’s a smart system that can drop its payload and return, making it reusable if desired.

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For all the people saying just make a storm shadow. lol

 

[Ak01]

Wow, you seem to have it all figured out, Baykar engineers wasted all that effort for nothing. lol

There is no indication that the Storm Shadow can get through better. These things are case dependent. This drone has AI and and coordinate and think, unlike the missile. It can carry out munitions, whether air to air or air to surface, it can carry jammers, can the storm shadow do all this?

The AMRAAM and Patriot was mentioned b/c it costs something to shoot down a target. Yet if the cost to shoot an AMRAAM can be justified, then why can the Drone not be justified.

Don't think that just b/c the Shahed costs $35,000 that no other price point for a strike platform can be justified.

We are literally seeing Ukraine use TB2 sized drones as Kamikazi drones, flown DEEP into Russia to great effect. THIS is why Baykar pursued a similar project in the first place, the only thing they have improved on is using their breakthroughs on swarms and AI from the Kizilelma project and integrating it into this TB2 sized drone.

Your post is a piss poor cop out full of copium.

The K2 is literally a TB2 with less fancy kit and more fuel tanks.

We have seen the survivability (or lack thereof) of the TB2 in contested environments.

Its pretty pathetic that you want to die on this hill that the storm shadow, a LO, highly intelligent CM is less survivable than a low cost MALE drone lol.

Ukraine is another poor cop out, do you, or the prospective customers have the ISR backing that Ukraine does? Ukraine will be receiving regular data on SAM batteries and their placements, allowing the operators to plan profiles to avoid them. So please, spare us the cope and the "Wow, you seem to have it all figured out, Baykar engineers wasted all that effort for nothing. lol". Because by this exact logic, nobody is allowed to be critical and everything would work as intended. Who are we to say the pantsir is a poor system, do you know more about missile design than the engineers who worked on it? Give it a break.