Vance: America hasn't won a single war in the last 40 years

[Beijingwalker]

Had President Kennedy not been assassinated in 1963, chances are good the US would have been gone from Vietnam by 1965. He was concerned enough in early 1962 that discussions were underway about withdrawing. He recognized the situation for what it was and that it wasn't worth it.

Vietnamese were fighting their own civil war with the intention of bringing the whole country and their people reunited, what the heck did it have anything to do with US? Did they attack US?

 

[AZ_HighCountry]

Vietnamese were fighting their own civil war with the intention of bringing the whole country and their people reunited, what the heck did it have anything to do with US? Did they attack US?

That is the point I am trying to make. It had nothing to do with us. In fact, as early as 1956, advisors were reporting back on the situation. One report documented how Ho Chi Minh wanted to establish relations with the US. The US advisor stated something along the lines of "we can either work with him now or fight him later".

I need to go back and resurrect those sources. It's been years.

 

[LeGenD]

Bro , you are awestruck by America's exploits ....you will need Ai help in deduction.

Mate, it is important to establish facts in any discussion. I acknowledge achievements of all sides in war as well as losses of all sides in war. My responses in this thread are in the context of this discussion. There is absolute lack of acknowledgement of American achievements in war in this thread and I have provided details in here and here to set the record straight. Your assumption that the US have fought an exhausted adversary in every war is incorrect. The Spanish Empire not being at its peak when the US seized its colonies in the Pacific is but one case study but the US has found a way to defeat formidable adversaries in different conflict situations from time-to-time as mentioned here. This is certainly an impressive track record of achievements in war. If Pakistan had these achievements in war, you would have found me to be awestruck by it on the same level as you see in this thread. But I see typical Asian insecurity in responses.

 

[mythbuster]

Vietnamese were fighting their own civil war with the intention of bringing the whole country and their people reunited, what the heck did it have anything to do with US? Did they attack US?

Containment of red menace was the goal ....right or wrong is debatable .

 

[Persian Gulf]

not exactly true but I don't mind if he wants the USA to adopt a less interventionist stance

 

[Beijingwalker]

Containment of red menace was the goal ....right or wrong is debatable .

Do you want your country to stay divided and not united? it's all nations rightful desire to seek unification.

 

[delta2]

As mentioned here, the US has crippled Iraqi defenses and dismantled Saddam setup in Iraq whereas Israel has crippled Syrian defenses and dismantled Assad setup in Syria. Israel has also reduced power and options of other opposing forces in the region. Now Iran is vulnerable. The US stand to gain from Israeli exploits in the region as both have disagreements with same forces.

Saddam wasn't a poodle of any side. He made his own calls but bad luck followed him. There was a time when Iraq and Syria contemplated merger to create a larger and stronger country in the region but neither Saddam and nor Assad were willing to concede political power and influence to the other. Both had inflated ego.


The Anglo-Spanish War was fought in the 18th century whereas the US-Spanish War was fought in the 19th century. The Spanish Empire was not in great shape in the 19th century due to internal conflict but it maintained a sizable force to protect its colonies in the Pacific. Battles of this war are well-documented here. The USN defeated a Spanish Armada guarding the Philippines with good ships and American troops overcame a large Spanish force in Cuba with good tactics. In this war, the US showed that it could project power in distant lands like other colonial powers and joined the elite club.

The Spanish Armada guarding the Philippines in 1898:

View attachment 98970


Can you imagine the logistics requirements of transporting a large number of troops from the American mainland to Europe back in those days and for the first time in history? OR do you think that a war can be fought in a distant land with magic?

The British Raj could not win the war. The Battle of St. Mihiel followed by the The Meuse-Argonne Offensive in 1918 proved decisive and these were US-led operations.

View attachment 98985

American General John Pershing employed a combined-arms approach to achieve breakthrough in The Battle of St. Mihiel. Famous American military officers George S. Patton, Douglas Mac-Arthur, and George C. Marshall also fought in this battle.


These battles did not help turn the tide of the war. The Battle of the Somme was fought in 1916 and failed to provide breakthrough. Canadian forces provided breakthrough in the Battle of Vimy Ridge in 1917 but the momentum was lost in the Nivelle Offensive. The Battle of Passchendaele was also fought in 1917 but gains were limited and the region was abandoned in the face of the German Spring Offensive in 1918.


Who taught you history buddy? The Pacific War between the US and the Imperial Japan started in 1941 and the US was able to dispatch a large military force to Europe in 1942.

German forces had overwhelmed Poland, France, Luxembourg, the Netherlands and Belgium by 1940. British forces were routed from France but managed to counter Italian forces in Libya in 1940. However, German forces arrived in Libya in support of Italian forces to establish Afrika Corps and pushed the British back into Egypt in 1941. The US and the British joined hands to defeat Afrika Corps in Libya in 1942 (Operation Torch). The US-led forces invaded Italy in 1943 (Operation Husky followed by Operation Avalanche) - this development made it impossible for Germany to resupply its forces in the Eastern Front to overcome Soviet forces in the Battle of Kursk and the tide turned in the Eastern Front. The US-led forces overthrew Mussolini setup in Italy but were facing heavy German resistance in the region so they opened another front in France in 1944 (Operation Overlord) in an attempt to stretch German defenses and advance towards Germany from both directions. These developments broke the back of German forces as they lost their best mechanized divisions in clashes with Allied Forces in the Western Front and exposed Germany to invasion from all directions.


Funny.

Did not learn my WW1 and WW2 history from the broken American school system.

Canadian victories in WW1 broke the German spirit as well as their backs. The victories came right exactly when the WW1 entered its final phase. The USA's arrival did nothing major.

As far as the WW2 in the Pacific was concerned, China had been fighting against Imperial Japan since 1936. The USA came into WW2 way too late just like in the WW1.

Had there been no China fighting and putting up a fierce fight against Imperial Japan, the Japanese would have crippled and completely annihilated the USA.

Imperial Japan had a plan to destroy the USA's urban populations by using chemical/bilological weapons but the Japanese high command decided against it because they thought it would be too inhumane.

Now compare that with the racists running the USA at that time. The moment they had a weapon of mass destruction they used it on civillians in Japan.

Every war the USA fought that they barely came out of alive, the ended up glamourising it as a stunning victory.

 

[mythbuster]

Did not learn my WW1 and WW2 history from the broken American school system.

Canadian victories in WW1 broke the German spirit as well as their backs. The victories came right exactly when the WW1 entered its final phase. The USA's arrival did nothing major.

As far as the WW2 in the Pacific was concerned, China had been fighting against Imperial Japan since 1936. The USA came into WW2 way too late just like in the WW1.

Had there been no China fighting and putting up a fierce fight against Imperial Japan, the Japanese would have crippled and completely annihilated the USA.

Imperial Japan had a plan to destroy the USA's urban populations by using chemical/bilological weapons but the Japanese high command decided against it because they thought it would be too inhumane.

Now compare that with the racists running the USA at that time. The moment they had a weapon of mass destruction they used it on civillians in Japan.

Every war the USA fought that they barely came out of alive, the ended up glamourising it as a stunning victory.

Yep , Hollywood is a great equalizers of history .

 

[Beijingwalker]

Did not learn my WW1 and WW2 history from the broken American school system.

Canadian victories in WW1 broke the German spirit as well as their backs. The victories came right exactly when the WW1 entered its final phase. The USA's arrival did nothing major.

As far as the WW2 in the Pacific was concerned, China had been fighting against Imperial Japan since 1936. The USA came into WW2 way too late just like in the WW1.

Had there been no China fighting and putting up a fierce fight against Imperial Japan, the Japanese would have crippled and completely annihilated the USA.

Imperial Japan had a plan to destroy the USA's urban populations by using chemical/bilological weapons but the Japanese high command decided against it because they thought it would be too inhumane.

Now compare that with the racists running the USA at that time. The moment they had a weapon of mass destruction they used it on civillians in Japan.

Every war the USA fought that they barely came out of alive, the ended up glamourising it as a stunning victory.

"Based on the investigation of the Japanese Yomiuri Shimbun, the military death toll of Japan in China is about 700,000 since 1937 (excluding the deaths in Manchuria).

Another source from Hilary Conroy claims that a total of 447,000 Japanese soldiers died or went missing in China during the Second Sino-Japanese War. Of the 1,130,000 Imperial Japanese Army soldiers who died during World War II, 39 percent died in China."

 

[Beijingwalker]

Vance: "We fought many wars in the last 40 years but haven't won a war"

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[mythbuster]

Do you want your country to stay divided and not united? it's all nations rightful desire to seek unification.

Through out history there had been a clash between morality and reapolitik ...you can build arguments for both sides.

 

[Beijingwalker]

We Were Taught That America Only Wins Wars | Vietnam & Afghanistan | Prof.Richard Wolff

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[Fatman17]

Vance: America hasn't won a single war in the last 40 years
View attachment 97588
"If you think about all those bipartisan, mass votes, we have to ask ourselves, what did they get us? We got a country that has fought a lot of wars in the last 40 years, but we haven't won a single war," Vance said.
He said Hegseth's primary task would be to "fix the problems at the Department of Defense," which includes increasing the number of recruits and fixing the incredibly weak weapons procurement process.

The Q is why does America need to go to war? It doesn't have any territorial disputes with anyone. However it needs "war" to ensure that the Military-Industrial Complex continues to flourish .

 

[Fatman17]

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[AZ_HighCountry]

Eisenhower was a wise man.