PA MLRS, Self Propelled and towed artillery [BM-11, Fatah-I GMLRS, Fatah-II] - News, Updates & Discussions

Hardly.... Not even 10% I must say....
and it should not be - after all if a E-3 loss was revealed by the Saudis post Trumpet fumbling mouth then there has to be truly a driving incentive to reveal on what May was about and leave the rest to “no damage was done by Pakistan”
 
Hardly.... Not even 10% I must say....

Sir What Pakistan did in Afghanistan and results were verified by 3rd party, something like that? Like a famous proverb, "KAAM KARDA PATA LAGDA AE". Nahi to we should chalk 90% as strategic, behind the scene stuff which can't be used as a tactical victory.

1774948131309.png
 
Sir What Pakistan did in Afghanistan and results were verified by 3rd party, something like that? Like a famous proverb, "KAAM KARDA PATA LAGDA AE". Nahi to we should chalk 90% as strategic, behind the scene stuff which can't be used as a tactical victory.

View attachment 189268
The 90% categorizes a lot of stuff in many domains, I don’t claim to know all of it, but even the little I have been privy to tells me that there was more unprecedented action taking place in less discussed domains than even the downing of fighter jets. Take EW & ELINT/SIGINT for example.

To those asking if lessons have been learned and things have improved post may. Of course, it would be alarming if they hadn’t, there have been some new and some old toys inducted as well, but we have a long way to go, and perhaps not the capacity to go all the way. Neither side was close to expending even a small amount of their potential arsenals, and even if a full scale conventional war seems less Likely (as opposed to skirmishes) both sides need to prepare keeping in mind that worse case scenario and have to extrapolate requirements based on the limited scale of this conflict.

The other thing is that warfare is evolving so rapidly that a lot of what was relevant in may is already not. In my analysis the fight in may happened at a period of transition for both Pakistani and Indian forces; both forces were/are in the process of inducting and catching upto what modern warfare has become (Re: Ukraine-Russia & now Iran) and hence the fight was fought with partially old and partially new tactics. I see it as a positive that while lessons were learned from the conflict, it didn’t change the armed forces mind that they needed to slow down the transition to new tactics and equipment by too much to strengthen current capabilities (they were strengthened for sure, but there was a possibility that we saw a much larger pause in transition to cover the gaps in the existing capabilities).

The thing is that under the current scenario, offense has become far cheaper and more cost effective than defense, this was rarely ever the case in the history of warfare, and as such is rather unprecedented. Offensive systems like drones and missiles have developed & evolved far quicker & become far cheaper than the defensive systems that can counter them effectively, this won’t always be the case, the defensive systems can and will catch up, but for the foreseeable future offense is the name of the game, and it’s where the mid term investment needs to be; put too many cards in defense and you’ll still only succeed 75% of the time with nothing to show for it (in a sense that’s what the outcome of the hits on Pakistani infrastructure were in may, less than 10% of Indian ordinance hit their marks, but since Pakistan didn’t have a seemingly effective retaliation, it seemed like that 10% mattered a lot, even though if you look at it like a glass half full, one could say Pakistan effectively stopped 90% of Indian attacks).

Warfare is a very unique form of science, it’s one of the fields where things evolve a lot more than they go obsolete, stuff like tanks and conventional Air defense and other hardware that seems to have fallen behind will catch up to modern warfare sooner or later, they will find their place, but it is a far sounder strategy to get with the times now than wait for your existing hardware to catch up. There is never a yes or no answer to if Pakistan or india are doing things right or wrong, it’s always a spectrum of really smart to really stupid decisions going on at once.

Some of the stuff about May and post-may developments you’ll hear as it trickle outs with time, much of it will probably never see the light of day, as Oscar said, it should stay like that.​
 
and it should not be - after all if a E-3 loss was revealed by the Saudis post Trumpet fumbling mouth then there has to be truly a driving incentive to reveal on what May was about and leave the rest to “no damage was done by Pakistan”
I think the concept of diminishing returns also applies to publicizing capabilities in return for public acknowledgment.

Just how much would Pakistan gain from publicizing Wins in the EW or logistical or intelligence domains? Most of the public can’t really grasp the importance of any of those apart from enthusiasts like on the forum, so there’s no major incentive to give that up.

Stuff like downed jets and blown up bases are easy public consumption, how they get downed or hit are of far less importance to the public, hence no need to confirm how exactly the enemy fighters were downed.

Same with afghan targets being struck, they will show videos of the strikes, the public will eat it up, nobody cares what the platform used for the strike was.
 
What happened to the Fatah 3? Last year in May there was a test launch of 'Abdali', but the official video from this test was what appeared to be a Fatah 2, with a claimed range of 450km. I'm guessing this 'Abdali' is a nuclear tipped version of Fatah 2? Or would it be the Fatah 3?
 
Shaheen 1A seems too large to be produced en mase for tactical strikes, and doesn't seem suitable for canistered transport or launch. My guess would be a two stage Fatah 2 to boost the range to around 1,000km.
 
What happened to the Fatah 3? Last year in May there was a test launch of 'Abdali', but the official video from this test was what appeared to be a Fatah 2, with a claimed range of 450km. I'm guessing this 'Abdali' is a nuclear tipped version of Fatah 2? Or would it be the Fatah 3?
The Fatah 3 was called the 'Abdali weapon system" and has supposedly range of 450km which is weird. It looked quite different from the Fatah 2 , and i hope we see it in the parade.
In the May conflict there was a news of Launch of the older abdali by us which doesnt look like the wreckage india claimed it was:

pakistan-launched-a-nuclear-capable-tactical-ballastic-v0-p87qd4gql3vf1.webp
 
The Fatah 3 was called the 'Abdali weapon system" and has supposedly range of 450km which is weird. It looked quite different from the Fatah 2 , and i hope we see it in the parade.
In the May conflict there was a news of Launch of the older abdali by us which doesnt look like the wreckage india claimed it was:

View attachment 190217

Indians were claiming lot of shit, I believe on several occasions misidentified their own fired Pechora SAMs as Pakistani missiles.
 
I think Pakistan current emphasize on cruise missiles for F-4 and possible 1000km F-5 is too costly to mass produce in like more than 100. So why bother then if we will not be able to field them in larger numbers ? Shouldn't we be going the Iranian way and focusing more on guided rockets and missiles (SSMs) ? Only the rockets will be able to carry larger warheads for longer distances in a cheaper and fast fashion.


And also, should Pakistan rocket force also start looking into 2-3 underground missile storage bases to prevent destruction of these assets in any pre-emptive situation attack ?
 
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