Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[SolarWarden]

A covert surrender of IRI. Turns out that all of Vance' statements were correct. Iran is giving up her highly enriched uranium and every step of the Iranian nuclear program is getting under the supervision of IAEA.

The situation in Israel has politically imploded because they were unable to achieve all their objectives from this conflict [no missiles, civil war, no nuclear, more sanctions]. It is important that we do not allow our feelings to cloud our judgment. I do not perceive this as a victory for Iran, even if the sanctions were to be lifted, which I believe is unlikely, but that is merely my perspective. Many overlook the upcoming two months of negotiations. If this MoU represents the least that both parties have agreed to, then what lies ahead will likely impose even greater restrictions on Iran's nuclear program.

In my opinion, the United States has emerged as the winner. Iran will be permitted to continue its ballistic program along with some degree of sanctions relief, but it will essentially abandon its nuclear program.

What are you guys celebrating here? The Iranians lost the war if this is the outcome.

Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm open to change my opinion.

They either are living in denial or are not comprehending what they are reading and somehow have come to the conclusion it is an Iran victory. Ignorance is bliss. This saying fits many in here.

 

[Pakistan First]

The Iranians had no plans to build the bomb as far back as Obama. Now they have no sanctions that were there since 1979. How is this not a win?

Absolutely! Iran definitely came into stronger position post war then it was pre-war. Its clear as a day. I had written a detailed post in this regard few days back in same thread. Wars are never measured by who dropped more bombs. Wars have geopolitical goals. US clearly lost this war.


Iran didn't had nukes so adding "never will have a nuclear weapon' doesn't hurt Iran a bit. In addition Iran got another nuke which is its influence and control over global power supply choke point. It has displayed that it can block it at will whenever it wants.

But I must also state that some people out of emotions are saying this is even bigger defeat than Vietnam. Not at all! A war where irreplaceable amount of lives and resources and time was invested and it all was lost (a decade + and tens of thousands of US soldiers, 1000s of aircrafts). There's not a remote comparison bw both. Vietnam lost was much more enormous than this mere air campaign only of just 6 weeks.

 

[krash]

Have they been removed, or do we have an unconfirmed draft that states that USA "undertakes to terminate all types of sanctions against the Islamic Republic of Iran, ...... in an agreed upon schedule as part of the final deal. ........ expressed their intentions to immediately address these issues in the negotiations in order to achieve mutual agreement on them."



Not quite the same, Sir.

↓ I'll still concede to "will have done it".

As long as the US doesn't renege,

Reads a little different to me. Still, it's clearly on the table and at worst it seems to be based on the acceptance of US demands which I don't see Iran rejecting, again as long its all in good faith. This will be good for everyone, including the US.

And then there are these two,

The United States of America undertakes that immediately upon the signing of this MOU and until the termination of sanctions, US Department of Treasury will issue waivers for the export of Iranian crude oil, petroleum products and derivatives, and all associated services, including banking transactions, insurances, transportation, etc.

The United States of America undertakes to make fully available for use the frozen or restricted funds and assets of the Islamic Republic of Iran upon the implementation of this MOU.

Friday dur ast.

 

[Meengla]

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

Very insightful of Ryan Grim and I don't think anyone would mind that except for Natyanyahu's Likud supporters and the Israel Firsters in America.
And perhaps Indians would mind that too

 

[RedRock]

I dont understand how people can be happy so soon. Sort of premature.

Iran will be losing its nuclear material. If it refuses to let go of it, the bombing will resume. If it does not give it up then Iran has definetly won!

Also, Lebanon is a goner. Israel will not retreat. If it does, then it will definetly be a win, no question about it.

Will the funds for reconstruction be released to Iran. Trump will not send a dime, probably he will ask the Arabs instead. If Iran gets it, then yes, it's a win on that front.

Sanction removal is by far the best outcome if it's implemented. Irans development was being held back just because of that. They are a tenacious bunch of people, highly educated and with removal of sanctions they will easily overtake every country in the region, economically and militarily.

But, Netanyahu's minions have already started threatening the paedophile regime in US with releasing more files. Will it cause Trump to back track or is Netanyahu doing it so that they are given a free hand in lebanon. Time will tell.

Iran should realise that they should not risk their country because of lebanon. I feel they should wait till they have a strong air defence and air force before attacking Israel again if Israel does not stop attacking lebanon or does not return the land. They should go into over drive to have everything within 3 to 6 months and then go ballistic on Israel. But until then just rearm and regroup. Send thousands of FPV drones and hundreds of missiles to Hezbollah and Yemen and then attack Israel if they continue their madness in lebanon or gaza.

But for now stick to the deal regardless of what Israel does in lebanon and at the same time keep threatening to walk away from the deal if Israel does not stop and return the land. So basically rearm themselves, Hezbollah and yemen till they are ready for another round and capable of blocking hormuz and the other side as well.

Edit: Iran should purchase from turkey, China or even pakistan and build stuff themselves. Forget Russia completely

Also i forgot to add, the only reason the israelis are saying its bad deal is because Netanyahu failed to get american boots on the ground in iran and decimate irans missiles capabilites as well as remove all nuclear material and plants. Also they wanted complete control of irans oil and gas and basiclaly the entire country. They did not want to settle for anything less. This deal still allows Iran to be a major threat to Israel. And that's what is pissing them off that the Americans did not die for their cause.

 

[VCheng]

Reads a little different to me. Still, it's clearly on the table and at worst it seems to be based on the acceptance of US demands which I don't see Iran rejecting, again as long its all in good faith. This will be good for everyone, including the US.

Still a draft, and still not finally signed. Yes, everything is indeed on the table, but what steps will need to be taken to make it all eventually possible are still unknown at this point.

And then there are these two,

Those two indicate that waivers will be given until the final agreement is reached, whenever and however that might happen.

Friday door ast.

Yes, and 60 days is even further away, and even that limit is extendable by mutual agreement.

 

[Meengla]

A covert surrender of IRI. Turns out that all of Vance' statements were correct. Iran is giving up her highly enriched uranium and every step of the Iranian nuclear program is getting under the supervision of IAEA.

How can you be so wrong?! The Iranian nuclear program was always a bargaining chip and they have used that wonderfully.
SMH!

 

[SolarWarden]

The vast majority of US offensive capabilities will remain in the region and final couple weeks of 60 day ceasefire if Iran has not fulfilled any or part of deal you're going to see USAF aircraft start flying to the region again. I just can't see Iran destroying their enriched uranium.

 

[Shags101]

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/trump-suggests-us-would-have-run-out-of-ammo-if-it-had-kept-bombing-iran/

So this is the time where trump is actually being honest now I’m not saying the military would run out of all weapons but the most high end costly weaponry seems to have reached critical levels air defense missiles and tomahawks etc

 

[krash]

Absolutely! Iran definitely came into stronger position post war then it was pre-war. Its clear as a day. I had written a detailed post in this regard few days back in same thread. Wars are never measured by who dropped more bombs. Wars have geopolitical goals. US clearly lost this war.


Iran didn't had nukes so adding "never will have a nuclear weapon' doesn't hurt Iran a bit. In addition Iran got another nuke which is its influence and control over global power supply choke point. It has displayed that it can block it at will whenever it wants.

But I must also state that some people out of emotions are saying this is even bigger defeat than Vietnam. Not at all! A war where irreplaceable amount of lives and resources and time was invested and it all was lost (a decade + and tens of thousands of US soldiers, 1000s of aircrafts). There's not a remote comparison bw both. Vietnam lost was much more enormous than this mere air campaign only of just 6 weeks.

I don't exactly see it as a defeat for the US either, a debacle yes but just another day in a hegemon's life. It will just walk away with losses it can recoup and still rule the world for its own benefit. The US was there because of the Israeli collar, seems to have shifted a little...Netanyahu should be worried. Nadan dost se dana dushman behtar hai. He isn't fluent in Urdu.

 

[Hazard]

If this deal gets signed and delivered as its written, Iran will eventually go on to become a regional power in this region. This is a breathtaking loss for US/Israel.

Pakistan should spring into action and get the gas/oil deal signed ASAP. Let's flood our country with cheap fossil fuels.

 

[ghazi52]

 

[VCheng]

View attachment 202069

ROFL. Iran can't shoot well with its left hand, and USA can't write well with its left hand!

 

[Meengla]

I don't exactly see it as a defeat for the US either, a debacle yes but just another day in a hegemon's life. It will just walk away with losses it can recoup and still rule the world for its own benefit. The US was there because of the Israeli collar, seems to have shifted a little...they should be worried. Dana' dushman, nadan dost se behtar hai. Netanyahu isn't fluent in Urdu.

Right. While I see this is a strategic defeat of Israel but for Americans, it is a setback. As long as Petro Dollar doesn't get replaced by Petro Yuan and as long as the Arab countries continue to buy a large amount of expensive American weaponry, America would be okay.
Israel... on the other hand, has played its last card and lost its last chance.

 

[krash]

Those two indicate that waivers will be given until the final agreement is reached, whenever and however that might happen.

That they do not.

The first will end when the sanctions are lifted, making the waivers moot; "Upon the signing of this MOU and until the termination of sanctions". The second will make the frozen assets fully available at the implementation of the MOU after which they will have been fully taken by the Iranians. The talks can go on.

Israel... on the other hand, has played its last card and lost its last chance.

Don't count them out yet. They are a particularly conniving bunch and have a lot of the US still under their hold.