POST WAR assessment of recent conflict.

[Cipher212]

So how many AEW&C Pakistan lost? India claims two Saab 2000.

At best one, if it was present in the hangar in Bholari.

Don't think anything or anyone was present in the Shahbaz main hangar.

They did hit one more hangar as well in Murid but that would just be a UAV

 

[Ali_Baba]

India is after 3 objectives: Azad Kashmir, Gunfire attacks and IWT.

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The Indian army realised that they could penetrate Pak air defence system in Mian Chunnu attack, and it exploited that this time.

Hopefully addressed very soon threw the procurement of CIWS type systems from China.

For sure, it couldn't stop Pak response, but unlike India's, Pak missiles didn't hit their targets effectively (due to non-photographic evidence).

The reliance on the Fateh series is a problem as it can never be as precise as a cruise missile, since a cruise missile is powered all the way to its target, it can make course corrections to get a higher CEP that a ballistic missile cannot do in its trajectory. Hopefully the PA/PAF see this and actually address the lack of precison asap, it is a real problem.

Fateh has a CEP of 10m, the Scap cruise missile is at 1m. Think about that interms of precision and what you can hit.

What India really wants is to negotiate IWT for more favourable conditions.

Maye, but will Pakistan ?

Pak may realise that it has AD gaps or strike gaps, so it would procure accordingly (budget issues). Pak has to defend PAF facilities, or any edge gained in surveillance, EW, and the upcoming J35 will be redundant.

Agree. Pakistan needs some kind of base and installation defences based off a CIWS solution (imho).

 

[Goenitz]

Agree. Pakistan needs some kind of base and installation defences based off a CIWS solution (imho).

If I were China, I would not give J-35 to Pak unless I also give them the means to protect these, both on the ground and air.
Such as an active protection system against drones near hangers (microwave and Trophy like system).
Similarly, China should provide (sale or loan) some defence equipment against Brahmos-type assault. It can be medium-range missiles (we have FD 2000 and HQ7, but not sure if these could prevent supersonic CMs) or some good EW and a Microwave fryer.

The loss of J35 (even export version) is far far greater than the success of shooting entire IAF Rafales.

 

[RafaleSlayer]

No. CT college incidence happened between May 8 and May 9.

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Besides.... CT college is minimum 14-15 KM away from the airbase...

View attachment 124135

farm fires fly at mach4 in india?
Human eye can't see a small farm fire from 15 KM away because earth curvature will cause it to dip by 18 meters. For a fire to be that bright and intense and that high to be visible from 15 KM away it cant be a small farm fire because of the earths curvature the earth will dip by almost 18 meters from 15 KM away

 

[MH.Yang]

So how many AEW&C Pakistan lost? India claims two Saab 2000.

The AWACS are so few in number that Pakistan can have them all together for its Independence Day parade. let the F-16 rumors be explained by the US media, who are more pissed off than Pakistan. What is really hard to confirm is the JF-17 rumor, after all there are too many of these planes.

 

[MH.Yang]

If I were China, I would not give J-35 to Pak unless I also give them the means to protect these, both on the ground and air.
Such as an active protection system against drones near hangers (microwave and Trophy like system).
Similarly, China should provide (sale or loan) some defence equipment against Brahmos-type assault. It can be medium-range missiles (we have FD 2000 and HQ7, but not sure if these could prevent supersonic CMs) or some good EW and a Microwave fryer.

The loss of J35 (even export version) is far far greater than the success of shooting entire IAF Rafales.

Protecting an airfield or two is not a problem. The real challenge is protecting all the important facilities. Pakistan is a country with too long a border, too little depth and a dense population.

 

[Goenitz]

Protecting an airfield or two is not a problem. The real challenge is protecting all the important facilities. Pakistan is a country with too long a border, too little depth and a dense population.

We can't change geography, perhaps 1-2 more air bases on our SW borders can help. However, we need to use weapons from small (guns) to big (SAMs) to counter drones to CMs.
I think it should be part of the next Shaheen exercise.

 

[MH.Yang]

We can't change geography, perhaps 1-2 more air bases on our SW borders can help. However, we need to use weapons from small (guns) to big (SAMs) to counter drones to CMs.
I think it should be part of the next Shaheen exercise.

What is the condition of the roads in Pakistan? Is it possible to take off and land fighter jets on the roads?

 

[Goenitz]

What is the condition of the roads in Pakistan? Is it possible to take off and land fighter jets on the roads?

I have seen only one road (M2) which is used for this purpose. It is also closer to the border, but the stretch is 500-600 km long.

Many fast delta-wing aircraft normally land here during the exercise.

There can be as many as 10+ points which can be used as runways.
There have been many motorways under CPEC, but not sure if these have been used or not.


Many western parts are in disturbed areas, so political security and stability are required for that.
Too many prblems

 

[Princeps]

At Barnala AFS this building/complex seems to have been hit: 30.4222152557342, 75.55049711861604

Damage on the roof is visible on Sentinel 2

 

[wangdefa]

我们无法改变地理位置，也许在我们的西南边界增加 1-2 个空军基地会有所帮助。但是，我们需要使用从小型（枪支）到大型 （SAM） 的武器来对抗无人机对 CM。
我认为这应该是下一次 Shaheen 练习的一部分。

这就是为什么中巴经济走廊 （CPEC） 在战争时期也可以作为巴基斯坦与西藏的物流纽带，却不受巴基斯坦的重视。

 

[Goenitz]

这就是为什么中巴经济走廊 （CPEC） 在战争时期也可以作为巴基斯坦与西藏的物流纽带，却不受巴基斯坦的重视。

Yeah man. We know we didn't take advantage from the CPEC. Not just in infrastructure but also in technologies like 5G, agricultural techniques, manufacturing capacities, and many more.

 

[MH.Yang]

Yeah man. We know we didn't take advantage from the CPEC. Not just in infrastructure but also in technologies like 5G, agricultural techniques, manufacturing capacities, and many more.

I once listened to a public lecture at Hunan University by a professor who was involved in developing the B&R strategy. He said that the initial expectation of the Chinese side for CPEC was to train a large number of qualified industrial workers and introduce the culture of an industrialized country in Pakistan through upfront infrastructure development. Then prepare for the later industrial transfer. But in the end, the Chinese government could only choose to record the four Mekong countries as the host country for industrial transfer. Unapologetically, the development of CPEC is not satisfactory.

 

[Tomcats]

At Barnala AFS this building/complex seems to have been hit: 30.4222152557342, 75.55049711861604

Damage on the roof is visible on Sentinel 2

Can you post the image please

 

[Fatman17]

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