Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[huanghong]

Source backup of your claim especially about 300+J20 according to @Deino there 180+ or so J20 in service?

If you want to discuss the number and proportion of various fighter jets in the Chinese Air Force, you can refer to this.
This is the detailed data obtained from official intelligence in the 2024 Japanese Defense White Paper issued by the Japanese Ministry of Defense.

 

[Hendarto]

Source backup of your claim especially about 300+J20 according to @Deino there 180+ or so J20 in service?

Deino is not god Even some of die-hard SDF said last year they delivered 75 and this year production reached 100 copies before that 75 used an Al-31F engine.

Right now there are confirmed 14 or 15 brigades operating J-20 if you average just 20 considering some of them are not full strength you have 300

https://twitter.com/x/status/1810329367853293832

https://twitter.com/x/status/1820094576368979979

 

[Hendarto]

Here the scramble magazine estimates one of the more reputable sources says as of Dec 2023 the production number is 250

Published: 28 December 2023 Last Updated: 28 December 2023
J-20A Mighty Dragon production progress

Also in 2023, the Chengdu Aerospace Corporation (CAC) J-20 production line at Chengdu-Huangtianba has been very active.

Scramble Magazine received confirmation that the 4th Air Brigade that used to fly the Shenyang J-11 aircraft from Foshan air base as well as the 97th Air Brigade flying the Chengdu J-7E from Dazu air base have both converted to the CAC J-20A, with serials 61252 and 70282 noted so far.

With the 200th aircraft built noted early this year, total production should be getting close to 250. As a result at least nine People’s Liberation Army - Air Force (PLAAF) Brigades are flying the stealth CAC J-20A, with unconfirmed rumours about another five Brigades that also would have started flying the J-20A this year.

The other side, of course, is that the number of active J-7 units (China's development of the MiG-21) has fallen sharply this year with only about five brigades active.

 

[UKBengali]

Does anyone here know whether the current production J-20s are being fitted with WS-15 or still WS-10C?

@Deino
@Hendarto

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

If you want to discuss the number and proportion of various fighter jets in the Chinese Air Force, you can refer to this.
This is the detailed data obtained from official intelligence in the 2024 Japanese Defense White Paper issued by the Japanese Ministry of Defense.
View attachment 64924

Source? I want link, as per figures you posted here J20 is 200 in numbers not 300 in numbers and don't exaggerate the numbers of J20

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Deino is not god Even some of die-hard SDF said last year they delivered 75 and this year production reached 100 copies before that 75 used an Al-31F engine.

Right now there are confirmed 14 or 15 brigades operating J-20 if you average just 20 considering some of them are not full strength you have 300

https://twitter.com/x/status/1810329367853293832

https://twitter.com/x/status/1820094576368979979

Don't post X links its a bogus and unreliable source

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Here the scramble magazine estimates one of the more reputable sources says as of Dec 2023 the production number is 250

Published: 28 December 2023 Last Updated: 28 December 2023
J-20A Mighty Dragon production progress

Also in 2023, the Chengdu Aerospace Corporation (CAC) J-20 production line at Chengdu-Huangtianba has been very active.

Scramble Magazine received confirmation that the 4th Air Brigade that used to fly the Shenyang J-11 aircraft from Foshan air base as well as the 97th Air Brigade flying the Chengdu J-7E from Dazu air base have both converted to the CAC J-20A, with serials 61252 and 70282 noted so far.

With the 200th aircraft built noted early this year, total production should be getting close to 250. As a result at least nine People’s Liberation Army - Air Force (PLAAF) Brigades are flying the stealth CAC J-20A, with unconfirmed rumours about another five Brigades that also would have started flying the J-20A this year.

The other side, of course, is that the number of active J-7 units (China's development of the MiG-21) has fallen sharply this year with only about five brigades active.

Don't contradict yourself you're contradicting so much on your figures, the Japanese white papers says according to your above post is 200, you're saying it's 300+and now from that source it says 250

So please do tell me what's the actual figures and numbers of J20 in PLAAF?

 

[Deino]

Deino is not god Even some of die-hard SDF said last year they delivered 75 and this year production reached 100 copies before that 75 used an Al-31F engine.

Right now there are confirmed 14 or 15 brigades operating J-20 if you average just 20 considering some of them are not full strength you have 300

https://twitter.com/x/status/1810329367853293832

https://twitter.com/x/status/1820094576368979979

The point is maybe I'm not good (or good enough for you ), but (at least) I would still rate me one of the most reliable OSINT spotters in the West. Again, while you take each and every rumour for granted I try to be careful and rate a unit only as "confirmed" when it is confirmed.

Therefore fact that you don't agree with my estimation & calculation is surely due to you being too "overambitious" and my method of rating a unit as confirmed only via an image of a certain serial number and satellite imagery of J-20s at a certain base and not only once.

In essence I agree, that the production in 2023 was about 65-80 and in 2024 will reach maybe slightly +100: As such, there are indeed almost 300 built, but if all are delivered and in service is a different story and even more not all units are known.

But since we are on it: what are your units? ... I have:

- the 172nd & 176th as FTTC unit with not a full complement = 2 Brigades (about 12 J-20 each = 24)
- the 1st, 4th, 5th, 8th, 9th, 41st, 56th, 97th & 111th as confirmed = 9 Brigades (about 24 ac. each = 216)
- the 55th as highly likely and both the 54th and 19th as reportedly = 3 Brigades (maybe 8 J-20 at the moment)

--------------
altogether I would come to 272+ in service

- additionally there are rumours about the 131st and 2nd one preparing for conversion

What is your 15th confirmed unit then?

Does anyone here know whether the current production J-20s are being fitted with WS-15 or still WS-10C?

@Deino
@Hendarto

For now, all current serial production J-20s are just J-20 which are powered by the WS-10C. The J-20A with WS-15 is not yet in serial production for operational units, but I expect that soon we will see the first LRIP ones for additional trials and maybe a FTTB brigade.


PS: can we leave out this stupid discussion on Flankers and what's indigenous or Russian?!

 

[huanghong]

Source? I want link, as per figures you posted here J20 is 200 in numbers not 300 in numbers and don't exaggerate the numbers of J20

Link is here, you can download it yourself

Japan Ministry of Defense

www.mod.go.jp

Besides that, obviously compared to your [80-90% PLAAF has Russian/Soviet designs jets], these people's data is obviously closer to the official Japanese data
As for the number of J-20s, please remember that the 2024 white paper counts the total number in 2023, so it is possible that the total number is around 300 now. There may be errors, but the data no one has cited is more inaccurate than the data you claimed before.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Link is here, you can download it yourself

Japan Ministry of Defense

www.mod.go.jp

Besides that, obviously compared to your [80-90% PLAAF has Russian/Soviet designs jets], these people's data is obviously closer to the official Japanese data
As for the number of J-20s, please remember that the 2024 white paper counts the total number in 2023, so it is possible that the total number is around 300 now. There may be errors, but the data no one has cited is more inaccurate than the data you claimed before.

Did you read the link you posted in your post? I downloaded 2024 Japanese Defense ministry white paper it's says J20 is still in 200 in numbers

 

[TopGun786]

Don't post X links its a bogus and unreliable source

At least he provided some source (bogus or not).
What is your source for all above claims you made?
Don't tell me it is "trust me bro"?

 

[SteppeWolff]

At least he provided some source (bogus or not).
What is your source for all above claims you made?
Don't tell me it is "trust me bro"?

He's a Multi ID troll bro, but I guess you already know that.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

At least he provided some source (bogus or not).
What is your source for all above claims you made?
Don't tell me it is "trust me bro"?

I have no source but I believe in @Deino he says there are 180 or so J20, he's far more reliable than fanboys like @Hendarto on X claiming there are 300 + J20 in PLAAF

 

[Deino]

I have no source but I believe in @Deino he says there are 180 or so J20, he's far more reliable than fanboys like @Hendarto on X claiming there are 300 + J20 in PLAAF

Guys ... calm down! The point is simply that we have different methods to calculate and even more a different standard on what's rated "confirmed": Consequently he will be on the high side and me is surely on the lower end.

But if you look what I wrote above:



we are not really that far off, the only difference is on what number we can be sure!

 

[huanghong]

Did you read the link you posted in your post? I downloaded 2024 Japanese Defense ministry white paper it's says J20 is still in 200 in numbers

I am a little surprised.
I specifically told you that the 2024 White Paper records the number of J-20s in 2023.
As for the number of J-20s, please remember that the 2024 white paper counts the total number in 2023, so it is possible that the total number is around 300 now.
The reason is simple. 2024 is far from over, so you need the 2025 White Paper to know the number of J-20s by the end of 2024.
You should download the 2023 White Paper, where the number of J-20s is 140,
which means that even if the production does not continue to increase, the number of J-20s recorded in the 2025 White Paper will be at least 260.