Gaza-Israel Conflict | 2023-2024

[Meengla]

You are only native when your neighbours consider you natives like them. It requires centuries to pass since your ancestors have come to be considered a native.

You are right on that.
However, those large numbers of Israelis born and raised in Israel over the large few decades DO have the natural human attachment to their country. I don't think they are all too willing to jump on some boats to safer havens unless really forced to. It is not good to base the outcomes on our desire outcomes: Human nature is at play everywhere.
Having said that, yes, Israelis are much more likely to flee to safer havens when it gets rough in that region. The locals don't have options available in Europe and America.

 

[Falcon29]

Hezbollah can unleash maybe 200,000 rockets, missiles and drones in any all-out conflict.

Zionist defences would be overwhelmed within days due to sheer scale of Hezbollah onslaught.

This would not be "repairable" damage but catastophic.

I am not even talking about Houthis, Iraqi/Syrian resistance joining in as well.

Entity is not a real country in any sense but a colonial output full of settlers who want to lord it over the natives.

Houthi's are not built to fight Israel. They help Iran threaten Saudi Arabia and Gulf nations, while also threaten Red Sea/Gulf of Aden area. Iraq's are also not built to fight Israel. Syria in its current state isn't either.



Only Hezbollah and Iran have had battle plans for Israel. And they are effective defensive ones. To change status quo in Occupied Palestine. You need a offensive battle plan which is involving everyone in the region to counter the massive US/NATO backing of Israel which will pressure US and Israel to accept two state solution.



Hamas misread Hezbollah's willingness to commit to a full blown war, and also misread Israel and Palestinians in Palestinian territories. But also Hamas had no other choice due to looming Israeli preemptive strike on Gaza and pressure of situation in Gaza. And had to make a final stand for Palestine in hopes it will somehow enforce a change in status quo and get other countries involved.



If Hezbollah backs out and comes to a agreement. Israel will likely occupy parts of Gaza for years to come and attempt pushing its residents out to other nations. What this did show us is there is no legit anti-Israel formation in the region. It really was just Hamas and Islamic Jihad in Gaza. Muslims and Arabs are actually quite tolerant of Jewish stronghold in the heart of the region. That is the ugly truth.



Only a miracle by God will change this.

 

[Meengla]

I am a Pakistani born and raised in London, UK. I have a british passport. However I am not a native to England. I am native to Pakistan. Blood is thicker than water.

Because Pakistan is a safe place for all Pakistanis despite Pakistan's warts. The Jews feel unsafe except in Israel. They have created a huge bubble of a make-believe world where only Israel is the safe place. Pakistanis don't suffer from such paranoia. Irony is that the Jews are thriving and even dominating in many countries and yet they are paranoid. It is a mental sickness that afflicts them!

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Because Pakistan is a safe place for all Pakistanis despite Pakistan's warts. The Jews feel unsafe except in Israel. They have created a huge bubble of a make-believe world where only Israel is the safe place. Pakistanis don't suffer from such paranoia. Irony is that the Jews are thriving and even dominating in many countries and yet they are paranoid. It is a mental sickness that afflicts them!

Deep down the majority of jews know that they belong in europe and not in israel. They are white europeans, they are NOT Middle Eastern nor do they have Middle Eastern heritage. That causes them to be unstable and act as fanatics. They are out of place in a land that is alien to them.

 

[Falcon29]

Houthi's are not built to fight Israel. They help Iran threaten Saudi Arabia and Gulf nations, while also threaten Red Sea/Gulf of Aden area. Iraq's are also not built to fight Israel. Syria in its current state isn't either.



Only Hezbollah and Iran have had battle plans for Israel. And they are effective defensive ones. To change status quo in Occupied Palestine. You need a offensive battle plan which is involving everyone in the region to counter the massive US/NATO backing of Israel which will pressure US and Israel to accept two state solution.



Hamas misread Hezbollah's willingness to commit to a full blown war, and also misread Israel and Palestinians in Palestinian territories. But also Hamas had no other choice due to looming Israeli preemptive strike on Gaza and pressure of situation in Gaza. And had to make a final stand for Palestine in hopes it will somehow enforce a change in status quo and get other countries involved.



If Hezbollah backs out and comes to a agreement. Israel will likely occupy parts of Gaza for years to come and attempt pushing its residents out to other nations. What this did show us is there is no legit anti-Israel formation in the region. It really was just Hamas and Islamic Jihad in Gaza. Muslims and Arabs are actually quite tolerant of Jewish stronghold in the heart of the region. That is the ugly truth.



Only a miracle by God will change this.

Also, just because Hezbollah is close to Iran, doesn't mean it doesn't have its own calculations. Hezbollah has a long history with the Israeli occupation. They can hurt Israel for a month or two in a big way but after that it can become lopsided against Lebanon if there isn't assistance from third parties. Financially and militarily. Hezbollah understand there is no actual plan by Iran nor Arab and Islamic nations to fight a major and proper campaign against Israel. It would be Lebanon on its own and Israel has time on its side thanks to unending support by NATO and US.

That's part of the reason they didn't go in with Hamas. Basically what they can achieve is to distract attention away from Gaza at a big cost for Lebanon. And they don't think it's worth it. And they believe Lebanese people would be furious if that was the reason to go to war.

And I can't blame them. It makes sense. They like Hamas and need Hamas and vice versa. But there is a ceiling to what they can do if Arabs nor Iran actually take a initiative to resupply and economically support a war effort.

And it's unfortunate for Gaza but is the reality. That being said, we still don't know if Israel will attack Lebanon, regardless. And if things may spiral out of control in wider region for whatever reasons. But right now the calculations is a net loss if committing to full blown war effort against Israel, in the long run.

 

[UKBengali]

You are right on that.
However, those large numbers of Israelis born and raised in Israel over the large few decades DO have the natural human attachment to their country. I don't think they are all too willing to jump on some boats to safer havens unless really forced to. It is not good to base the outcomes on our desire outcomes: Human nature is at play everywhere.
Having said that, yes, Israelis are much more likely to flee to safer havens when it gets rough in that region. The locals don't have options available in Europe and America.

They of course will have an attachment to where they live but they know it is not their country but that of the Palestinians they pushed out and imprisoned in Gaza and West Bank.

 

[Falcon29]

 

[Falcon29]

There are large numbers of martyrs in the streets of the Shujaiya neighborhood, and we receive around the clock calls for help from those trapped in their homes and we cannot reach the neighborhood because it is being bombed at all times.

Civil Defense - Gaza

 

[Falcon29]

These people surely won the afterlife. They're fighting for the existence of Palestine, for Jerusalem and Islam, and for the survival of Gaza after Israel and other parties conspired to eradicate them. God bless them. They put rest of us Muslims to shame. That are absorbed by worldly desires.

Footage of Palestinian soldiers striking Israeli terrorist forces inside of Gaza. And firing rockets at Israeli formation in central Gaza:

 

[Falcon29]

 

[PakFactor]

The appealing lure of the concept of resistance. It's similar to ISIS in many ways not the purpose of the resistance but the appealing nature of it. Resistance is often equated with being a force-upon duty, and obligation of the highest honor and dignity since its cause gives justification to martyrdom. Hamas always had that appeal of resistance, but it has raised the stakes immensely for both sides of the coin, certainly the appeal but also the detraction. Fortunately the former has far outweighed the latter.


Sadat realized this on October 14th, 1973, when the United States began conducting Operation Nickle Grass. He knew the US' support was lurking in the shadows prior to that but needed to see it with his own two eyes and when the influx of weapons from tanks to fighter jets to SAM systems were being sent in droves & droves to fight and kill Egyptians and prevent us from acquiring our OWN LAND back that was brutally & viscously & illegally stolen......................he knew right then and there for sure it was confirmation of exactly what you're saying and that essentially, in his words, we would be fighting America now and that is an impossible war to win. That day, October 14, 1973, was the official start of the unconditional support of the zionist entity that has only multiplied ten-fold since then and exactly what you alluded to. The rest is history.

This also plays a huge part in the reason the Arab leaders are not confronting the zionist entity in the manner we all wish they would, even diplomatically or economically is risky on a grand scale, let alone militarily. Weather it's justifiable or not is another whole topic entirely on its own. But that is the essence of the reluctance to confront the murderous, genocidal demonic zionist entity. The sooner people realize that, the sooner their understanding will reach a higher level and have a much more educated understanding of the complexity of this conflict.



I just have two words for these lowlifes, mother fu%(ers!



And some might wonder why I call this orange baboon a scum-sucking jackboot racist thug pig bastard from hell. His racist views extend well beyond the norms and are specially elevated when it comes to Arabs, but particularly Muslims. It doesn't really take a genius to see it and I've called him out on that way back when I met him in person at a real estate business seminar/convention in downtown Boston back in the mid-1990s.

"Senator Chuck Schumer, he's become a Palestinian he's Jewish used to be loyal to Israel but now he's become a Palestinian"

Let that sink in for a minute. He even used it on Genocide Joe in the debate and went even further in that one, calling Biden a "Palestinian
and not even a good one".

That's why this guy is even more dangerous than Genocide Joe when you really think about it. Not just for the domestic issues in the United States, but especially when it comes to Muslims in general.



I damn near fell out of my recliner the other day when I read this. So much for the sanctity of the constitution and how easily it's being dismissed as basically irrelevant. In this case, it's as if it doesn't even exist, let alone respected by law. Such a shame.

When the founding fathers decided on this exact, particular phrase to be the essential wording in the text of the constitution:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

They got together and made sure Thomas Jefferson drafted the exact words that made it as simple, but as clear as possible that the intended principle is to protect the freedom and independence of religion both from BOTH government restrictions AND from government sponsorship and attendant control.

Those last three words are as clear as day, aren't they? The fact that this can be taken to court and argued against is crazy. The founding fellas made sure the text was written in a precise and articulate manner to leave no ambiguity as to the context. Yet this is one of the most argued provisions of the constitution and what these people did is about as gross of a violation of that sacred document (and rule of law) meant to protect the rights of the people and which is looked up to and emulated by almost every single other country & people wishing to seek a life under the same democratic freedoms & values as the United States, not to mention why the US is the most attractive migrant destination in the world. It's a travesty what those people did.

That's correct. In Ukraine, Russia is indirectly fighting the U.S. and practically all of Europe. One major difference is that Russia can sustain itself through its military-industrial complex on the low end and soon on mid-to-high tech from China and North Korea. On the other hand, the Middle East lacks industries and extensive know-how beyond small arms to replenish its forces. The maintenance, upkeep, and overhauling of their military are reliant on Western supplies. Essentially, the Middle East hindered itself by not developing internal capabilities.

 

[hussain0216]

That's correct. In Ukraine, Russia is indirectly fighting the U.S. and practically all of Europe. One major difference is that Russia can sustain itself through its military-industrial complex on the low end and soon on mid-to-high tech from China and North Korea. On the other hand, the Middle East lacks industries and extensive know-how beyond small arms to replenish its forces. The maintenance, upkeep, and overhauling of their military are reliant on Western supplies. Essentially, the Middle East hindered itself by not developing internal capabilities.

And I was error about this yesterday, not only are the Arabs complicity in the slaughter, they have wasted hundreds of billions of not trillions on over priced western weapons that are often downgraded and they still have useless militaries


If they spent that money in the Arab and Muslim world we could have had multiple programs from jet to tanks to missiles


Look at Iran, all alone it's has developed multiple programs, imagine what the Muslim world together can do?


And instead what the cockroach leaders of the Arab world have led them too

 

[GoMig-21]

@VCheng , even an American-born Jew raised in Miami, FLA and lived in Israel for a period is running for congress because she understands not only the plight of the Palestinians, but also that a 2-state solution is IMPOSSIBLE as many of us here understand as well and have been trying to convey to you. But for some reason you still seem to be holding out unrealistic hope that not only can it be achieved, but in record time as well which is even more bizarre considering what I know of you and your ability to rationalize things.

Between minute 3:26 - 3:37 (11 seconds) is all you need to hear, and she puts it as simply as can be. Is she mistaken also, like the rest of us?

This is what Muslim countries are good for:

EU signs €1 billion financing deal with Egypt as part of migration deal

https://www.euractiv.com/section/gl...ng-deal-with-egypt-as-part-of-migration-deal/

Do you guys expect beggar countries like these to do anything meaningful for the Palestinians? Scavengers and poodles that survive on handouts. They do the bidding of outsiders.

Your blind, vitriolic disdain of Arab leaders but also Arabs in general is really showing (pretty sure you include the Arab population as a whole, as well, with your combined & repetitive insults with the use of the terms "beggar nations, scavengers & poodles") to the point that it has clouded your ability to see or understand the realities on the ground, the actual true & authentic reasons for signing agreements such as this one. You either aren't making the effort to understand why, or you choose not to in order to push your anti-Arab narrative.

It's gotten so bad to the point where you just automatically and instinctively associate things like this agreement with being beggars, poodles and scavengers and such a thing is the reason that makes them "do the bidding of outsiders?" Why did you fall just short of calling them ZIONISTS instead of "outsiders"? hahaha.

Sorry, Dalit, I'm usually with you on most things but the absurdity of this is entirely on another level, just can't let it go.

This agreement has roots that go back to 2013 and the devaluation of the Egyptian pound and the devastated economy post-revolution, contrary to your wishful thinking that it's related to some deal that assists the zionists and makes Arabs complicit in this genocide which is the most egregiously disgusting insult one can ever make to not just an individual country, but an entire region with a group of nations and their entire populations. Shame on you and the others who keep peddling this bullshit on this board and if you think most of us will just sit here and take it, you got another thing coming because it's abhorrent. Worst of all, is nothing but a gaddam lie! Let's take a look at this article you linked, shall we?

This is the first tranche of a €7.4 billion EU funding package pledge in financial support for Egypt’s economic reforms and an upgraded relationship in exchange for energy sales and stemming migrant flows to Europe.
The EU has concluded similar deals with Tunisia, Mauritania and Turkey.

Energy sales and stemming migrant flows to Europe which means illegal migration because this is part of a larger military cooperation in the Mediterranean Sea between Egypt & the EU to conduct maritime missions to curb the massive flow of people trying to flee from Africa, mostly from through Libya which can't do much to stop it due to the civil war going on there.

This was also decided between Egypt and Greece in particular, which is why we've had MANY naval exercises with them in the last 8 years for this exact reason and now that Egypt & Turkey have mended ties, there will also be naval cooperation for that exact same reason. Tunisia included because of its strategic location. How beggar of us!

The loan agreement is also in addition to the extensive cost the Egyptian Navy has incurred for its need to modernize the entire fleet. That loan will ease the payments for several of the new frigates & submarines etc. How poodle-ish of us!

There's also this:

As part of the overall deal, both sides signed a flurry of agreements that would cover a range of policy areas.

This included a Green Sustainable Industry program fed by a €30 million EU grant, designed to aid Egyptian industry in investing in pollution reduction, decarbonisation, energy and resource efficiency. It also included three financing agreements worth a total of €36 million.
Another €60 million EU support package was also agreed on to improve grain storage in Egypt under the Food and Resilience Facility.
As part of the new investment push, European companies signed more than 20 new deals or memoranda of understanding (MOUs) worth some €40 billion.

“The €40 billion of investment agreements, if you look at the national figures of Egypt, that is four years of foreign direct investment,” Várhelyi said, adding this could “bring the golden age of EU-Egypt relationship”.

The companies in question would be looking to invest are in sectors such as hydrogen, water management construction, chemicals, shipping and aviation.
Cairo has been betting on its natural gas reserves to gain access to foreign currency, while the EU has sought alternatives to Russian gas since its war on Ukraine has cut trade ties between the two sides.
“Egypt could not only become able to supply its own electricity, but Egypt could become a serious supplier of Europe, a reliable supplier of Europe with green electricity,” How scavenger of us!

God forbid Egyptian or Arab leaders try and look for the development & enriching of their own countries for the betterment of their own people because to hell with all of that, they're just a bunch of zionist stooge cucks hellbent on the destruction of the Palestinians and are closet zionists or whatever other BS you & co. like to constantly peddle on this board and in particular this thread, simply because of your hatred of Arabs and for other agendas that I won't get into here for now since I don't wish to derail the topic. Suffice it to say, I will always call you -- or others -- out whenever you try to peddle these despicable lies and untruths and the complete manipulations of the truth to demean Arabs. I have absolutely no qualms about doing that to set the record straight which I honestly wish I didn't have to do. I wish all of us supporting the Palestinian cause would cease from the demonizing of Arabs and Muslims since all that does is create a misguided divide. It disunifies us and actually helps the enemy out more and it's made even worse when it's fabricated untruths.

 

[PakFactor]

And I was error about this yesterday, not only are the Arabs complicity in the slaughter, they have wasted hundreds of billions of not trillions on over priced western weapons that are often downgraded and they still have useless militaries


If they spent that money in the Arab and Muslim world we could have had multiple programs from jet to tanks to missiles


Look at Iran, all alone it's has developed multiple programs, imagine what the Muslim world together can do?


And instead what the cockroach leaders of the Arab world have led them too

The problem is that the Middle East wasted funds on vanity real estate projects that produced no real output for the country.

According to conversations within my business circle and those currently residing in the UAE, etc., the real estate bubble that's been building up will pop in 7-11 months after the U.S. election period. Word is that some numbers are being shared, and books were cooked in the UAE. They could face a liquidity crisis; it will be up to the U.S. to then come up with funds. (Coupled with talks with the U.S. of sharing extensive data on property purchases). Many investors are now trying to de-risk their portfolios.

 

[PakAl]

This is speechless. There are only Muslim people, not Muslim governments. I honestly think we have Zionist Jews as some of the leaders in the Arab and the Muslim world. There is nothing else that can explain their treachery.

Just like normal Muslim citizens sell their souls for money and power, the leadership does the same. They will not sacrifice their power for Gaza or anywhere else. They too want to be allies with the big boys.