In the age of drones, towed guns is probably obsolete in modern warfare

Yommie

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Towed guns take long to set up and pack up. To make matters worse, their shells are easily tracked by modern counter battery radars which have pinpoint accuracy in locating them. Not to mention small drones are cheap and built quickly in the millions a year. So. In my opinion. Towed guns go the way of the giant battleships of the 1940s.

 
@Yommie would you be willing to sit in an Abrams or leppard tank and charge full steam toward a Russian strong point in the Donbas? If I were to give you a million dolla?

Would you do it?

Would you fly F-16 and attack Lughansk if you were paid $2 million dolla?
 
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Lets see in the context of India vs China at LAC: We are in the mountains, Chinese are on the Tibetan plateau. Their terrain is different.

The PLAGF artillery must be on vehicles 'cause they have less hiding places. Where necessary, we will have MGS and K9 in the mountains as well, like North Sikkim, Depsang and Chushul.

If your Counter battery fire capability is so good that you can take out a self-propelled gun, then an MGS will not fare any better. The IA has actual combat experience in the mountains, more than any other army in the world, so of course the IA is more logical. The US Army as well, their infantry and Stryker units only use light towed guns instead of tracked guns. With all that said, there's something else people don't realize, Chinese guns are not fully automated, so their shoot and scoot capabilities are limited compared to something like the Archer.

So the current ATAGS MGS is slightly more automated than the Chinese PCL-181 'cause it won't manually load the round, only the charge.

Experts suggest that truck-mounted howitzers and self-propelled artillery excel in flat terrain, whereas they face significant challenges in navigating mountainous terrain. Areas with superior infrastructure, such as the newly built DSDBO road in India with multiple prefabricated military truss bridges and roads, could support their deployment. Another option is the 105mm Indian field guns, which can be dismantled and reassembled, making them suitable for use in high mountain peaks. To deploy artillery in the Himalayas, a combination of towed, truck-mounted, and self-propelled guns would be most practical.

So things aren't all as they are cracked up to be when considering the differences in equipment and tactics between the Indian and Chinese forces at the LAC.
 
So things aren't all as they are cracked up to be when considering the differences in equipment and tactics between the Indian and Chinese forces at the LAC.
no one is talking about india and china facing off here. its a general discussion.
 
???
What do you mean “probably”? Towed guns are absolutely obsolete and we’ve known that since the 1960s when the USSR designed the 2S1 and we the M109. Any force that still use towed guns either have special needs (helicopter airborne in the case of M777) or are limited to using old stockpiles by circumstances (Russia and Ukraine). Any military that makes and or procures towed guns post 2000s are either poor or sheer dumb schmucks.

Weak against drones and counter battery are but a very very very small facet about the limitations of towed guns. Off-roads mobility, inefficacy in rapid response, CBRN, sustained RoF, munition capacity, etc etc.
 
But carries less explosive power than than towed guns
Huh?
A 155mm M795 will pack the same amount of punch no matter if it’s fired from a M777 or an M109.

If you are referring to the propellent, both have exactly the same 70 liter chamber volume with the same propellent options.
 
Lets see in the context of India vs China at LAC: We are in the mountains, Chinese are on the Tibetan plateau. Their terrain is different.

The PLAGF artillery must be on vehicles 'cause they have less hiding places. Where necessary, we will have MGS and K9 in the mountains as well, like North Sikkim, Depsang and Chushul.

If your Counter battery fire capability is so good that you can take out a self-propelled gun, then an MGS will not fare any better. The IA has actual combat experience in the mountains, more than any other army in the world, so of course the IA is more logical. The US Army as well, their infantry and Stryker units only use light towed guns instead of tracked guns. With all that said, there's something else people don't realize, Chinese guns are not fully automated, so their shoot and scoot capabilities are limited compared to something like the Archer.

So the current ATAGS MGS is slightly more automated than the Chinese PCL-181 'cause it won't manually load the round, only the charge.

Experts suggest that truck-mounted howitzers and self-propelled artillery excel in flat terrain, whereas they face significant challenges in navigating mountainous terrain. Areas with superior infrastructure, such as the newly built DSDBO road in India with multiple prefabricated military truss bridges and roads, could support their deployment. Another option is the 105mm Indian field guns, which can be dismantled and reassembled, making them suitable for use in high mountain peaks. To deploy artillery in the Himalayas, a combination of towed, truck-mounted, and self-propelled guns would be most practical.

So things aren't all as they are cracked up to be when considering the differences in equipment and tactics between the Indian and Chinese forces at the LAC.

Indians besterest use sticks and stones to fight Chinese.

At worse you just get beaten up, and later given super duper meals

images

main-qimg-c63f204b37532e804629d75a12a41a75-lq


Unless you yearning for immortality and never worried about aging.


Bear in mind China never ever taken into consideration India

All the time, China is preparing to take on and fight USA and whatever allies USA can armtwist into being USA missile fodder.

India military might is a tiny tiny fraction of USA

So as said, besterest for India to use sticks and stones and fists to attack China.
And Indians can end up with getting wonderful super duper meals
 
Lets see in the context of India vs China at LAC: We are in the mountains, Chinese are on the Tibetan plateau. Their terrain is different.

The PLAGF artillery must be on vehicles 'cause they have less hiding places. Where necessary, we will have MGS and K9 in the mountains as well, like North Sikkim, Depsang and Chushul.

If your Counter battery fire capability is so good that you can take out a self-propelled gun, then an MGS will not fare any better. The IA has actual combat experience in the mountains, more than any other army in the world, so of course the IA is more logical. The US Army as well, their infantry and Stryker units only use light towed guns instead of tracked guns. With all that said, there's something else people don't realize, Chinese guns are not fully automated, so their shoot and scoot capabilities are limited compared to something like the Archer.

So the current ATAGS MGS is slightly more automated than the Chinese PCL-181 'cause it won't manually load the round, only the charge.

Experts suggest that truck-mounted howitzers and self-propelled artillery excel in flat terrain, whereas they face significant challenges in navigating mountainous terrain. Areas with superior infrastructure, such as the newly built DSDBO road in India with multiple prefabricated military truss bridges and roads, could support their deployment. Another option is the 105mm Indian field guns, which can be dismantled and reassembled, making them suitable for use in high mountain peaks. To deploy artillery in the Himalayas, a combination of towed, truck-mounted, and self-propelled guns would be most practical.

So things aren't all as they are cracked up to be when considering the differences in equipment and tactics between the Indian and Chinese forces at the LAC.
The Tibetan plateau is a plateau, not a mountain. Do you know what a plateau is? The Tibetan Plateau looks like this. It's perfect for self-propelled artillery and vehicle-mounted howitzers.

IMG_20240710_223644.jpg

IMG_20240710_224152.jpg

Also, China has over 3,000 vehicle-mounted rockets, over 4,000 self-propelled artillery pieces, and 12,000 PCL-181 (SH-15) vehicle-mounted howitzers are expected to be built. Do you think China's artillery is a small ant like India's?
 
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The Tibetan plateau is a plateau, not a mountain. Do you know what a plateau is? The Tibetan Plateau looks like this. It's perfect for self-propelled artillery and vehicle-mounted howitzers.

View attachment 54693

View attachment 54694
Our doctrine is different from the PLA. 105mm is primarily deployed to suppress advancing infantry and to provide quick fire support to mountain troops, it is very light and can be lifted by the exisiting Mi-17V5 and Dhruv helicopters of the Indian aviation forces. These guns can be disassembled in pieces and transported in secrecy to locations without letting the enemy know about it. Towed guns like 105mm is not obsolete as you guys claim. US army, Italian army, British army, Korean army all still use 105mm in various roles. These guns have a good history of raining punishing fire on Pakistan Army during ceasefire violations.
 
Also, China has over 3,000 vehicle-mounted rockets, over 4,000 self-propelled artillery pieces, and 12,000 PCL-181 (SH-15) vehicle-mounted howitzers are expected to be built. Do you think China's artillery is a small ant like India's?
 
Risky to operate, not obsolete. if anything, the war showed how every equipment is valuable and can be lethal if used efficiently.
 

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