India guns for 12 more 'eyes in sky'

[DDG-80]

Issue is in their training and packing a punch by integrating Awac with all platforms. I.e intraoperability .

IAF Prepares for Digital Dominance with Near-Complete AFNet Upgrade

India's Air Force stands poised to enter a new age of networked warfare, as the ambitious upgrade to its Advanced Air Force Network (AFNet) nears completion by the end of 2024. This cutting-edge, satellite-based communications system promises to revolutionize situational awareness and transform...

defencepk.com

Indian Army begins induction of Akashteer system to sharpen air defence posture

NEW DELHI: The Indian Army has begun the induction of the indigenous Akashteer system to boost its air defence capabilities, officials aware of the matter said on Thursday. The automated air defence control and reporting system will allow the army’s air defence units to operate in an integrated...

defencepk.com

 

[harpy1]

Question to members who understands awacs

The new netra awacs that India is inducting is indengious home grown how does it compare to both

The phalcon awacs and indeed the Pakistans awacs systems

 

[Zarvan]

India is full of cash they can buy the most advanced expensive AWAC that's not an issue.
Issue is in their training and packing a punch by integrating Awac with all platforms. I.e intraoperability .
That's why they were defeated on 27 February 2019. Their airchief of that time accepted that PAF utilised their Awac in far better manner.

For now they don't even have enough numbers. Yes smooth integration plus intraoperability are also major issues but right now their focus should be on completing their numbers

 

[vkdindian]

IAF is way way behind it this regard. The Netra programme should have started with a clause to keep inducting newer version after first three were inducted.
But, this story of buying stuff in small pockets keeps ailing our procurement planners. Why can’t they just induct a system in adequate numbers in one go?
Even this number of 12 isn’t adequate for our entire air space if we include island territories. We should have atleast 18-20 to cater to all the theatres having their own assets.
Indian Navy has proven to be way smarter with their P8Is.

 

[Guru Dutt]

IAF is way way behind it this regard. The Netra programme should have started with a clause to keep inducting newer version after first three were inducted.
But, this story of buying stuff in small pockets keeps ailing our procurement planners. Why can’t they just induct a system in adequate numbers in one go?
Even this number of 12 isn’t adequate for our entire air space if we include island territories. We should have atleast 18-20 to cater to all the theatres having their own assets.
Indian Navy has proven to be way smarter with their P8Is.

well MOD baboons specially handling IA & IAF work is starnge pace now since new govt has been formed things are pretty clear so lots of great news to come in very short time

 

[harpy1]

One thing under modi five more years expect
More french weapons like rafale scorpene etc
And
More indengious systems like netra awacs another carrier more kolkatta class destroyers and much more invested in Indian home grown weapons

Russia is out of the picture now they can't supply India needs with their war on in Ukraine

 

[DDG-80]

IAF is way way behind it this regard. The Netra programme should have started with a clause to keep inducting newer version after first three were inducted.
But, this story of buying stuff in small pockets keeps ailing our procurement planners. Why can’t they just induct a system in adequate numbers in one go?
Even this number of 12 isn’t adequate for our entire air space if we include island territories. We should have atleast 18-20 to cater to all the theatres having their own assets.
Indian Navy has proven to be way smarter with their P8Is.

These 12 AWACS are just adding to the 6 we already got, making it 18 in total for the IAF.
And India isn't stopping there either. We're getting 31 MQ9B drones with awesome SeaSpray X Band AESA surveillance radar and more than 20 MPR and HPR systems to up our surveillance capability. And we're also investing heavily in satellite-based SAR/ISAR surveillance. We've got all angles covered.

 

[DDG-80]

One thing under modi five more years expect
More french weapons like rafale scorpene etc
And
More indengious systems like netra awacs another carrier more kolkatta class destroyers and much more invested in Indian home grown weapons

Russia is out of the picture now they can't supply India needs with their war on in Ukraine

IN's not going for more Kolkata or Vizag destroyers. They're opting for 8 P17B frigates along with the 7 P17A frigates already in the water. . Plus, there's 8 next-gen corvettes with frigate-level firepower and endurance, alongside 6 next generation missile vessels and 4 Tushil class frigates. MDL's starting work on the Project 18 destroyer too, which will have 120 VLS cells and a defense system like Aegis, loaded with SMART ASW missiles and Varunastra torpedoes. LRDE's 6-meter LR-MFR is already operational on INS Anvesh and getting ready for more upcoming warships.

 

[vkdindian]

well MOD baboons specially handling IA & IAF work is starnge pace now since new govt has been formed things are pretty clear so lots of great news to come in very short time

Fingers crossed.
I wouldn’t point fingers at Baboos only. Even the services haven’t done a good job at playing their part in the procurement cycle. Broth has gone bad due to all the cooks here.
IN has somehow evolved much better, in this regard, if we leave aside their quest for submarines.

 

[Guru Dutt]

well the old ERJ-145 platform on which NETRA was based is bieng discontineued but there are many such copies in comerrcial second hand market avilable that too on cheap rates and already a few are bieng nagociated for while already they have purchsed /aquired 6 EX Air India A320 air frames for MK2 variant for which fabrication of avionicks suits antennas started way back in late 2023 /early2024 so already so how long it will take for them to be ready is not substanitial ammount of time ... point is what they are hidding cause what they are telling again and again is old news

 

[Yasser76]

Fingers crossed.
I wouldn’t point fingers at Baboos only. Even the services haven’t done a good job at playing their part in the procurement cycle. Broth has gone bad due to all the cooks here.
IN has somehow evolved much better, in this regard, if we leave aside their quest for submarines.

It really is inexplicable that major force multiplyers like AWACS, Air to air refuellers and EW Support planes are in the IAF in very limited numbers. I would argue the money spent on 36 Rafales was instead spent on say 10 more AWACS, 10 more refuellers would have had a much bigger impact on IAF capabilities overall.

 

[vkdindian]

I would argue the money spent on 36 Rafales was instead spent on say 10 more AWACS, 10 more refuellers would have had a much bigger impact on IAF capabilities overall.

Money is not the issue here. Processes and procedures are the culprit in all procurement related cases in India.

The number of these force multipliers is indeed well below the desired numbers. It appears that they are trying to rectify the mistakes.

 

[Yasser76]

Money is not the issue here. Processes and procedures are the culprit in all procurement related cases in India.

The number of these force multipliers is indeed well below the desired numbers. It appears that they are trying to rectify the mistakes.

Money is an issue, it's an issue for every country, in fact some of these tenders were cancelled due to expense

 

[vkdindian]

Money is an issue

You are right and wrong. Right, because India isn’t a first world country with unlimited money and has to ration it. Heck, even first world countries have to spend carefully, so India can’t be reckless in this regard.
Wrong, because the cases we are discussing were not due to money buy poor handling of procurement.

Example - PAF. They have more number of AWACS than IAF. They inducted J10 with much less fuss than that was possible in India. PAF has secure communication for decades. Did, India not have enough money to get them? There are many other cases.

India has adequate resources to get what they want, but, we need better procurement policies. IAF always asks for the moon, gets a few pieces of that equipment while they could induct an effective but much cheaper variant in adequate numbers, that can do the job.

 

[Bossman]

View attachment 16828
NEW DELHI: India is now stepping on the gas to develop and induct advanced indigenous airborne early-warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft or "eyes in the sky", which will boost surveillance and detection capabilities along the China and Pakistan borders as well as help direct friendly fighters during air combat with enemy jets.

The DRDO-IAF combine is actively pushing ahead with progammes to develop six Mark-1A as well as six Mark-2 versions of the Netra AEW&C aircraft, three of which were earlier built and inducted from February 2017 onwards.

Sources said defence ministry will next week take up the acceptance of necessity (AoN) for the six Mark-1A aircraft, which will entail mounting active electronically scanned array antenna-based radars, electronic and signal intelligence systems on Embraer jets, at a cost of around Rs 9,000 crore.

"These six AEW&C aircraft will be like the first three Embraer-145 jet-based Netra, which have 240-degree radar coverage. But there will be better software and more advanced technologies like new gallium nitride-based TR (transmit/receive) modules for the radars," a source said.

The developmental work on the six Mark-2 aircraft, with bigger and more capable versions of the AEW&C radars and sensors to be mounted on second-hand Airbus-321 planes bought from Air India, is already at an advanced stage at a cost of Rs 10,990 crore.

"Delivery of the first such AEW&C Mark-2 aircraft, which will also have an antenna in the nose in addition to the main dorsal antenna to give 300-degree radar coverage, should take place in 2026-27. Technologies from the Mark-2 aircraft, in fact, will flow into the Mark-1A ones," the source added.

Both the projects are critical for India because it is lagging far behind Pakistan, let alone China, in the AEW&C and AWACS arena. Apart from the three Netras, IAF only has three Israeli Phalcon AWACS mounted on Russian IL-76 transport aircraft - with 360-degree radar coverage and a 450-km range - that were inducted in 2009-2011 under a $1.1 billion deal.

Pakistan now has 10 Swedish Saab-2000 Erieye AEW&C and Chinese Karakoram Eagle ZDK-03 AWACS aircraft. China has around 30 AEW&C aircraft, including Kong Jing-2000 'Mainring', KJ-200 'Moth' and KJ-500 aircraft.

In a major plus for IAF, the existing Netras and the Phalcons are fully plugged into its integrated air command and control system (IACCS). This fully-automated air defence network with data links is being progressively expanded to integrate the wide array of military radars with each other as well as with civilian radars to plug surveillance gaps in Indian airspace.

So what happened to the Indian claims that their Maha super satellite coverage of Pakistan tells them when Pakistani jet take off?