Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[Shags101]

yeah and I am also at fault for taking the bait. Back to topic.

That’s why I’m moving on he very much not a neutral observer who calls out both sides he’s just another boring guy at least I call out those who are toxic on both sides

 

[VCheng]

I've repeated this about a dozen times here. The head you pretend is not bowed is in fact rubbing in dirt. The global bully will interfere everywhere and every time it deems fit for its purpose. It is your responsibility to not give it the excuses to do so until you actually can stand up to it or have no other choice. To stand up, you need to grow, to grow you need peace, for peace you need the bully to look elsewhere just long enough. The Chinese have been doing exactly that. The Korean War is an exact example of when they could and how much they could. In fact, and very unexpectedly, Pakistan did as well in acquiring its nuclear weapons. These fantastical pseudo-righteous stances are only good within the limits of drawing rooms. What have they yielded in the past 200 years? We've only sunk further. If you keep poking the global bully it will not let you make anything of yourself, see then if moral arguments can come to your defense.

Golden Advice. Thank you for saying it directly.

 

[Oldenwisdom...قول بزرگ]

I've repeated this about a dozen times here. The head you pretend is not bowed is in fact rubbing in dirt. The global bully will interfere everywhere and every time it deems fit for its purpose. It is your responsibility to not give it the excuses to do so until you actually can stand up to it or have no other choice. To stand up, you need to grow, to grow you need peace, for peace you need the bully to look elsewhere just long enough. The Chinese have been doing exactly that. The Korean War is an exact example of when they could and how much they could. In fact, and very unexpectedly, Pakistan did as well in acquiring its nuclear weapons. These fantastical pseudo-righteous stances are only good within the limits of drawing rooms. What have they yielded in the past 200 years? We've only sunk further. If you keep poking the global bully it will not let you make anything of yourself, see then if moral arguments can come to your defense.

Do you know when China became a nuclear power? 1964. Korean war ended in 1953. China didn't wait till it became nuclear power to protect what it assumed were it's core interests. China didn't wait the US to establish diplomatic relations either... full relations didn't establish till 1979. Before Nixon, US didn't even recognize PRC as legitimate government of China... that was ROC.
US will leave mideast and bully now is zion. And zion is it's own worst enemy helping isolate it globally... by their own chosen hubris. For those who want the hammer to drop on their head before they act... we're actually living past that drop on the head!

 

[krash]

I wonder why not a single country in the region is able to do this , is that because this is pie in the sky thinking ? The US/Israel are the instigators of the conflicts in the wider region and will continue until they are exhausted or defeated.

You haven't been looking. The Gulfies, Turkey, India, and even Pakistan in many instances (nuclear weapons, China, Afghanistan) have had reasonable success.

Maybe use Google yourself and realize the target of Korea and Vietnam wars were....Korea and Vietnam. China was not getting bombed or blockaded or coup'd , instead it has received trillions worth of Western money and tech transfer due to policy of Globalization.

Tell that to the Chinese who jumped into both with their socks on.

Yes it was the mistaken policy of Globalization that the US now realizes was bad for it.

Magically didn't apply to the Iranians or everyone else overtly opposing the US.

Sulah Hudaibiyah...literally same talking points. Which Salafi channel do you copy paste from ?

You people always come out at this time of the year with the same message don't you ? Just in different ways. Don't try to disguise yourself using geopolitics.

Yeah, that was exactly as enjoyable as I expected it to be.

Next time leave the desperate sectarian BS aside. I'm beyond it and don't care if you aren't. Your religion, sect, favorite ice-cream have no baring on me or my arguments.

 

[PakAl]

LOL. Let us wait to see the terms of the deal first.

Usa is saying the terms of the deal favour them, Iran will never be able to build nukes, their facilities will be under inspectors control, enrichment will be taken out of Iran, Hormuz opened as normal. No gurantees on Lebanon, Yemen, Gaza and Usa will not withdraw from the middleeast, yes their build up will be reduced since their is no need for it anymore, Iran first and 2nd tier leadership all killed, Iranian funds will be unfrozen since they belong to Iran and Usa wants 300B to be given to Iran by GCC which i cannot see it happening, Strait of Hormuz will be toll free, maybe Iran will charge small fee for environmental reasons as alleged. Yes good idea wait till terms are released otherwise everyone is celebrating too early.

 

[VCheng]

Yes good idea wait till terms are released otherwise everyone is celebrating too early.

Exactly what I have been saying all along.

+1.

 

[krash]

Do you know when China became a nuclear power? 1964. Korean war ended in 1953. China didn't wait till it became nuclear power to protect what it assumed were it's core interests. China didn't wait the US to establish diplomatic relations either... full relations didn't establish till 1979. Before Nixon, US didn't even recognize PRC as legitimate government of China... that was ROC.

And it did it all with the other world bully standing right besides it. It clearly had the means to do what it did evident by the US' lack of response. Does Iran or any other Muslim country have these luxuries? We are bombed without a second thought. Do you think we have those means?

US will leave mideast and bully now is zion. And zion is it's own worst enemy helping isolate it globally... by their own chosen hubris. For those who want the hammer to drop on their head before they act... we're actually living past that drop on the head!

I pray it happens before you envision it. But in case it doesn't, do we have another plan?

 

[BHAN85]

https://www.aa.com.tr/en/americas/us-military-preparing-to-withdraw-20-of-refueling-aircraft-from-ben-gurion-airport-reports/3968527

Why not 100%?

 

[Watandar]

I've repeated this about a dozen times here. The head you pretend is not bowed is in fact rubbing in dirt. The global bully will interfere everywhere and every time it deems fit for its purpose. It is your responsibility to not give it the excuses to do so until you actually can stand up to it or have no other choice. To stand up, you need to grow, to grow you need peace, for peace you need the bully to look elsewhere just long enough. The Chinese have been doing exactly that. The Korean War is an exact example of when they could and how much they could. In fact, and very unexpectedly, Pakistan did as well in acquiring its nuclear weapons. These fantastical pseudo-righteous stances are only good within the limits of drawing rooms. What have they yielded in the past 200 years? We've only sunk further. If you keep poking the global bully it will not let you make anything of yourself, see then if moral arguments can come to your defense.

If the global bully does not need any excuses and will interfere where it wants, then why are you telling us not to give it excuses in the first place ? Doesn't that sound contradictory ?

Another major flaw in your argument is that the US has been laser focused on the region because of oil and Israel. THAT is the reason it has subjected the region to endless wars, coups, terrorism, autocracy and blockades for the last 70 years. Why would the US just suddenly go elsewhere and leave you to grow in peace ?

It is your arguments that are only valid in a vacuum and bereft of ground realities. "Poking the bear", yeah right as if Iraq, Iran, Syria, Palestine, Afghanistan, Yemen had ever launched an attack on America.

 

[Pakistani Dragon]

How much did those 13,000 strikes cost you and what did those 13000 strikes do for you?

Obviously nothing.

When in the History of humanity has a Country won a war decisively, only for it to go sit down with the country it decimated to hammer out a MOU and give financial concession to the loser?

What concessions?

The Americans blocked Iran's energy exports (which were not before the conflict), and now they are going to allow iran to export again.

In the meanwhile, Iran is asking the Americans to pay for war damages. The Americans are not asking for any war damages.

 

[Pakistani Dragon]

Lie.
The goal of the campaign was not 13.000 bomb sorties.

It were changing the regime.
Destroy the ballistic missile force.
Destroy the nuclear infraestructure remaining.
Stop Iranian influence over allies.

No one of them was achieved.

Even Israelí opposition is talking about "catastrophe".

The goal was just to bomb Iran as much as possible.

When is the new Ayatollah going to come out of his hiding to celebrate the Great Victory?

 

[krash]

If the global bully does not need any excuses and will interfere where it wants, then why are you telling us not to give it excuses in the first place ? Doesn't that sound contradictory ?

I've explained this repeatedly. It's the basic concept of keeping your head low and building, as much as you can for as long as you can or as long as you need. How is this concept difficult for anyone to grasp? I can't be expected to repeat this answer again.

Another major flaw in your argument is that the US has been laser focused on the region because of oil and Israel. THAT is the reason it has subjected the region to endless wars, coups, terrorism, autocracy and blockades for the last 70 years. Why would the US just suddenly go elsewhere and leave you to grow in peace ?

When you give the bastard enough of what it wants then it will leave you alone-er. If not as much as Turkey then at least as much as Pakistan.

It is your arguments that are only valid in a vacuum and bereft of ground realities. "Poking the bear", yeah right as if Iraq, Iran, Syria, Palestine, Afghanistan, Yemen had ever launched an attack on America.

Again, I've mentioned this very basic understanding before and will not repeat it again after this. Not poking does not ensure being left alone but gives you a chance at it. Poking ensures you have no chance.

 

[Oldenwisdom...قول بزرگ]

And it did it all with the other world bully standing right besides it. It clearly had the means to do what it did evident by the US' lack of response. Does Iran or any other Muslim country have these luxuries? We are bombed without a second thought. Do you think we have those means?

During that war... China had men... human wave attacks ... there was no parity in weapons. It is the same today... however today Iran has drones and missiles. It has embraced asymmetry and didn't even try conventional parity. That along with its geography provide a formidable challenge for any adversary or invaders. The onus is always on the invaders to achieve the set out goals. And prolonging the conflict was Iranian goal to get into a long-term slug fest. Iran will never invade another state regionally let alone on the other side of the world... so this is an imperial war by default. It's goals are imperial and it's geostategic goals are set in making the colonial project viable.... read "A Clean Break"...

A Clean Break: A New Strategy for Securing the Realm - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

https://www.dougfeith.com/docs/Clean_Break.pdf

The neocon project.

I pray it happens before you envision it. But in case it doesn't, do we have another plan?

For zion there is no back up plan... not yet at least... the US can retrench and faces no imminent threat.

 

[Trailer23]

Bottomline - Unless US/Trump order !srael to stop, I just don't see a Peace Deal.

Everyone will be onboard.

Iran will probably give into (most) of the US demands, but...

...eventually the Jews are gonna play Spoiler, pull a stunt & shift the blame on Hamas. And we're all back to square 1.

 

[Watandar]

You haven't been looking. The Gulfies, Turkey, India, and even Pakistan in certain instances, such as nuclear weapons, have had reasonable success.

The Gulfies are dictatorships whose relevance is oil and who were thrown to the wolves in this war. Pakistan is another dictatorship that has ruined itself engaging in proxy wars for the sake of Arabs/America. India isn't part of the region nor relevant to this particular discussion. Is that "reasonable success" for the people of the region ?

Tell that to the Chinese who jumped into both with their socks on.

Chinese were providing support to Korea and Vietnam, just like they are now to Russia and Iran. They were not directly involved in those conflicts and neither were they subjected to 70 years of American attacks. The comparison is invalid.

Magically didn't apply to the Iranians or everyone else overtly opposing the US.

This makes no sense at all.

Yeah, that was exactly as enjoyable as I expected it to be

Glad you are enjoying your arguments being shred to pieces.

Next time leave the desperate sectarian BS aside. I'm beyond it and don't care if you aren't. Your religion, sect, favorite ice-cream have no baring on me or my arguments.

Your arguments are valid only in a vacuum. They are bereft of real world inputs and outputs.