Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[shapurzolaktaf]

Iran destroyed the Iraqi armed forces more than once with those weapons while we were going through a revolution and under sanctions. It wasn't a sudden situational change. It's not like a wind blew and things changed out of the blue. The new regime openly went against the US and took their embassy staff hostage for 444 days, started chanting "Death to America" at every gathering. Situational change? As if it weren't in our hands to prevent it from happening and we weren't responsible for that?

Please do not repeat the same flawed analysis again. You will need over +100,000 missiles to compensate for the firepower of an air force, not to mention that your defense capabilities will be almost non-existent without an air force, like we witnessed it quite well just a month ago. We have done the calculation multiple times here. And we have fewer than 5K MRBMs to hit Israel. Some claim the number is even fewer than 3,000 MRBMs at this point.

I never said fighter jets are ineffective or not usable, but it is how it is now, revolution happened and we're in a new situation, life goes on, accept the history. You can't rely solely on westerners, they're not even selling their last and best fighter jet to Turkey (biggest NATO ally which supported them to secure Israel).

I always disagreed with any bad policy from Islamic republic, I mean the big-mouth policy, fueling western and zionist propaganda, althout the westerners kill and destroy countries in practise (Iran only chants).

But all of this doesnt change the facts: Iran is one of the most independent countries in the world, in top 3. We can't be used as a proxy against any country, we can't be forced not to produce certain weapons for our self-defence. We make our own decisions and agreements based on our own interest.

That we have not produce the amount is an organisational/logistical issue, not a technical or financial. So that was our own choice, it's not impossible and once done the enemy will be helpless (see Russia example, from importing shaheds, they are now MASS producing and MASS firing GERAN Drones).

I think the enemy was fearing this break-out (with Fateh just being introduced few years) and decided to attack. I will repeat my analysis, make a 1 to 1 comparison, price and risk for a fighter jet (including maintenance, weapons,) VS Long range Drones, Cruise and ballistic missiles. Investment in Drones and Missiles is also investment in development and technology because we keep them improving and complements other programs (space program for example). The fighter jet which you buy is foreign, you have to build the environment around it and once sabotaged, attacked or shot down by a better fighter jet, all your investment will be lost. So lets agree to disagree.

 

[ShapurII]

I never said fighter jets are ineffective or not usable, but it is how it is now, revolution happened and we're in a new situation, life goes on, accept the history. You can't rely solely on westerners, they're not even selling their last and best fighter jet to Turkey (biggest NATO ally which supported them to secure Israel).

I always disagreed with any bad policy from Islamic republic, I mean the big-mouth policy, fueling western and zionist propaganda, althout the westerners kill and destroy countries in practise (Iran only chants).

But all of this doesnt change the facts: Iran is one of the most independent countries in the world, in top 3. We can't be used as a proxy against any country, we can't be forced not to produce certain weapons for our self-defence. We make our own decisions and agreements based on our own interest.

That we have not produce the amount is an organisational/logistical issue, not a technical or financial. So that was our own choice, it's not impossible and once done the enemy will be helpless (see Russia example, from importing shaheds, they are now MASS producing and MASS firing GERAN Drones).

I think the enemy was fearing this break-out (with Fateh just being introduced few years) and decided to attack. I will repeat my analysis, make a 1 to 1 comparison, price and risk for a fighter jet (including maintenance, weapons,) VS Long range Drones, Cruise and ballistic missiles. Investment in Drones and Missiles is also investment in development and technology because we keep them improving and complements other programs (space program for example). The fighter jet which you buy is foreign, you have to build the environment around it and once sabotaged, attacked or shot down by a better fighter jet, all your investment will be lost. So lets agree to disagree.

We have cornered ourselves globally. Iranians are being treated worse than Jews in the World War II, short of them sending us to concentration camps and gassing us to death. Although, one could possibly argue that they did gas Iranians to death in the Iraq-Iran war.

Iran is far from independent. An independent nation would build the bomb instead of wasting her limited resources under sanctions on a civilian program that was not enough to satisfy our energy needs, and only was being used as a justification to sanction us and target us in war. Even before they obliterated our civilian nuclear program, it took us 10 years to produce enough fuel for just one year of operating the single nuclear reactor at Bushehr! Treason at its finest.

I really love how you guys pretend that our missiles and drones are built 100% inside Iran. This is so wrong on so many levels that I don't even know where to begin with. A nation that is 100% independent does not fire 1,000 drones in 12 days. It fires 10,000 drones in 12 days.

 

[shapurzolaktaf]

No, it's not. We can clearly see it with our own eyes

1. Who sidelined Iran from Syria talks after 2015?
2. Who undermined Iran's influence in Syria?
3. Who gave away Syria to Turkey on a silver platter?
4. Who delayed the sale of S-300 to Iran for 7 years?
5. Who didn't honor their contract to deliver Sukhoi-35s to Iran?
6. Who delayed the inauguration of the Bushehr nuclear reactor?
7. Who is helping Azerbaijan to cut off Iran from a major geopolitical corridor to Europe?
8. Who forced Iran to accept the new treaty on the Caspian Sea borders?
9. Who allowed 4 rounds of crippling UN Security Council sanctions to be passed against us?
10. Whose ambassador humiliated Iran by restaging the Tehran conference photo with the British ambassador?
11. Who depleted our drone reserves but gave nothing back in return?
12. Who dragged Iran into the Ukraine war to unite Europe against us?

Do I need to say more? Because the list can go on.

View attachment 134599

1. More so for USA than Russia
2. West more than Russia
3. West more than Russia
4. West more than Russia (arms embargo), although Russians played a game and we know each country has its own interest. Better receicing it late than never.
5. Better delay than never receiving any.
6. Better delay than never receiving any.
7. Israel, Turkey, Azerbayjan and lesser extent West. Russia not perse, Iran warned Russia that this is a red line, showing independent policy from Iran and not puppetry as you claim.
8. Russia together with the states bordering Caspian, but the outcome is not clear yet. Good thing is that no external party is allowed to enter Caspian (be it NATO allied countries or USA).
9. US, CHINA, ALL West, chasing their own interests.
10. Like how Rouhani was humiliated in Rome, through statues/art/pics?
11. Russia has it's own interests, Iran sold the drones (not for free) and it was a good marketing for our weapons. I'm not sure if Russia will sell anything back in turn, maybe yes, maybe no, wait and see.
12. No one, it was our own decision. Europe and USA gave chemical weapons to Saddam, we introduced our devestating drones to Europe.

If you search only for negative sides of our relation with certain countries, you will only find negative outcomes. But if you think with an open mind, denouncing both western and eastern propaganda, but agreeing that both west and east have and follow their own interests, then you'll see that the situation is not one-sided as you think.

For example: In December 1917, the Soviet government under Lenin formally annulled all Tsarist treaties with Iran, including:

• The 1907 Anglo-Russian Convention, which had divided Iran into spheres of influence.
• Other unequal treaties giving Russia military or economic privileges.
• Soviet Russia declared it respected Iran’s independence and territorial integrity.
• West supported chemical attacks against Iranian soldiers who captured strategic Faw
• West supported separation of HERAT and Bahrain from Iran
• West currently supports separatists, Russia and China don't.

You see, it's not black and white bro. You like Shah? watch here "delay-games" by France against Shah.

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[ShapurII]

1. More so for USA than Russia
2. West more than Russia
3. West more than Russia
4. West more than Russia (arms embargo), although Russians played a game and we know each country has its own interest.
5. Better delay than never receiving any.
6. Better delay than never receiving any.
7. Israel and west, Russia not perse. Iran warned Russia it's a red line, showing independent policy from Iran and not puppetry as you claim.
8. Russia together with the states bordering Caspian, but the outcome is not clear yet. Good thing is that no external party is allowed to enter Caspian (be it NATO allied countries or USA).
9. US, CHINA, ALL West, chasing their own interests.
10. Like how Rouhani was humiliated in Rome, through statues/art/pics
11. Russia has it's own interests, Iran sold the drones (not for free) and it was a good marketing for our weapons. I'm not sure if Russia will sell anything back in turn, maybe yes, maybe no, wait and see.
12. No one, it was our own decision. Europe and USA gave chemical weapons to Saddam, we introduced our devestating drones to Europe.

You just discredited yourself by writing this stupid, hilarious comment. You couldn't come up with even a single meaningful argument except for deflecting like Hack-Hook when you talk about the reformists to him. Everyone can see that Russia is treating Iran like a wh*re. You will never be looked again as a patriot after all this bullshit peddling.

Your KGB-trained Grand Ayatollah, who was groomed by Russia to rule over Iran, is ruining Iran and will ruin Iran unless stopped forcefully. Hopefully, he will die or be killed before that happens but the system he has created in the last 35 years is a ticking bomb that will explode soon.

If you search only for negative sides of our relation with certain country, you will only see the bad things. But if you think with an open mind, denouncing both western and eastern propaganda, but agreeing that both west and east have and follow their own interests, then you can see that the situation is not one-sided as you think.

For example: In December 1917, the Soviet government under Lenin formally annulled all Tsarist treaties with Iran, including:

• The 1907 Anglo-Russian Convention, which had divided Iran into spheres of influence.
• Other unequal treaties giving Russia military or economic privileges.
• Soviet Russia declared it respected Iran’s independence and territorial integrity.
• West supported chemical attacks against Iranian soldiers who captured strategic Faw
• West supported separation of HERAT and Bahrain from Iran
• West currently supports separatists, Russia and China don't.

You see, it's not black and white bro.

Soviet Russia declared it respected Iran's independence and territorial integrity? How can you lie so easily? Soviet Russia instigated separatism in Azerbaijan, Mahabad and Guilan.

Russia was the first country to sign the Emirates claims on our 3 islands. They literally started the trend. What a pathetic liar.

 

[shapurzolaktaf]

You just discredited yourself by writing this stupid, hilarious comment. You couldn't come up with even a single meaningful argument except for deflecting like Hack-Hook when you talk about the reformists to him. Everyone can see that Russia is treating Iran like a wh*re. You will never be looked again as a patriot after all this bullshit peddling.

Your KGB-trained Grand Ayatollah, who was groomed by Russia to rule over Iran, is ruining Iran and will ruin Iran unless stopped forcefully. Hopefully, he will die or be killed before that happens but the system he has created in the last 35 years is a ticking bomb that will explode soon.


Soviet Russia declared it respected Iran's independence and territorial integrity? How can you lie so easily? Soviet Russia instigated separatism in Azerbaijan, Mahabad and Guilan.

Russia was the first country to sign the Emirates claims on our 3 islands. They literally started the trend. What a pathetic liar.

I read accusations, rants as part of an emotional/triggered response.

Answer me:
1. Who separated Bahrain and Herat and who wanted to separate Khuzestan from Iran?
2. Russia has its own interests, like west, they're not obligated to do anything for us. Fact is our relation with Russia is independent: we have our red lines and have warned them about it (zangezur corridor), we don't recognize their separatist republics like Abkhazia and Ossetia (Syria did).
3. (ChatGPT): Did Khamenei study in the Soviet Union or Russia? No credible evidence supports this. Experts and official biographies contradict it.
4. (ChatGPT): Was Khamenei a KGB agent? No documented proof exists. It remains a fringe conspiracy without primary-source backing.
5. Who is supporting separatist forces against Iran in the last 45 years? West or China and Russia?
6. West caused a famine inside Iran and removed father of shah (Reza Mirpanj, the officer), they could not handle nationalization of oil (or that we demanded 50% of our own oil income) and made a coup against Mossadegh.
7. More tensions existed between Iran and Russia before 1979, especially during the Cold War, due to ideological clashes, Soviet territorial interference, and Iran’s alignment with the U.S. Now we have less tensions with Russia compared to before the revolution. We can't be used against Russia, which is a neighbour. West used Ukraine and Georgia against Russia and destroyed both countries.
8. West gave chemical weapons to Saddam and supported Saddam by sattelite info, pilots, chemical weapons. We gave drones to Russia to weaken west and earned money.
9. West is 1000x worse than China and Russia when it comes to oat and agreements. JCPOA and last aggression during negotiations showed that to us. The more agreements you make, the more bombs they throw on your civilians.
10. China and Russia don't massively bomb and kill and invade other countries, west does (Libya, Iraq, Yemen, Iran, Afghanistan, and so on).
11. West is declining, east and south are rising.
12. Who delayed nucleair program of Iran before the revolution? see the youtube clip which I posted.

Don't give your brain to zionist fools (they're truely fools, see their reputation and evil deeds). Just accept that all powers have their own interests and are not obligated to help us, both east and west. Learn from mistakes and improve the current situation.

 

[ShapurII]

I read accusations, rants as part of an emotional/triggered response.

Answer me:
1. Who separated Bahrain and Herat and who wanted to separate Khuzestan from Iran?
2. Russia has its own interests, like west, they're not obligated to do anything for us. Fact is our relation with Russia is independent: we have our red lines and have warned them about it (zangezur corridor), we don't recognize their separatist republics like Abkhazia and Ossetia (Syria did).
3. (ChatGPT): Did Khamenei study in the Soviet Union or Russia? No credible evidence supports this. Experts and official biographies contradict it.
4. (ChatGPT): Was Khamenei a KGB agent? No documented proof exists. It remains a fringe conspiracy without primary-source backing.
5. Who is supporting separatist forces against Iran in the last 45 years? West or China and Russia?
6. West caused a famine inside Iran and removed father of shah (Reza Mirpanj, the officer), they could not handle nationalization of oil (or that we demanded 50% of our own oil income) and made a coup against Mossadegh.
7. More tensions existed between Iran and Russia before 1979, especially during the Cold War, due to ideological clashes, Soviet territorial interference, and Iran’s alignment with the U.S. Now we have less tensions with Russia compared to before the revolution. We can't be used against Russia, which is a neighbour. West used Ukraine and Georgia against Russia and destroyed both countries.


Don't give your brain to zionist fools (they're truely fools, see their reputation and evil deeds). Just accept that all powers have their own interests and are not obligated to help us, both east and west. Learn from mistakes and improve the current situation.

What accusations? They were all facts. And they were related to post-revolution Iran in the last 20-25 years. The fact that you have to return to 100 years ago to come up with completely irrelevant counter arguments shows that you have nothing to say on the topic. That proves you to be the triggered one here, trying to defend the undefendable. Tsarist Russia and Soviet Russia annexed one-third of our territory. Why don't you talk about that if you want to go into our historical relations with Russia?

Russia has always been Iran's number 1 enemy throughout our history in the last 3 centuries.

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@1:37

I believe RT news is a state-owned Russian channel. When it says Khamenei graduated from there, do you think they are lying? OK. Let's assume they are lying. Why doesn't Iran summon the Russian ambassador over that? They are spreading rumors about our leader. That shouldn't go unpunished.

Don't bend over for Russians. They are one of the most evil, two-faced nations on the face of the planet. Their history is full of evil deeds. In fact, the most evil, supremacist Zionists are Slavs, mainly going there from Russia.

 

[Khorasan Black Flags]

over a lost cause like Iran.

It seems the zionist media has completely shaped your perspective

You've been completely brainwashed by zionist media, and you can only see the negative sides of your own country

 

[ShapurII]

It seems the zionist media has completely shaped your perspective

You've been completely brainwashed by zionist media, and you can only see the negative part of your country

Our only way to get out of the current situation is nuclear deterrence. Iran is massively under-armed against the US and we need nuclear deterrence to guarantee our sovereignty.

You guys never listen to reason until it's too late. You were one of those people who said Israel would never dare to attack Iran, and not only it happened, but we all agree that it would restart soon.

 

[Bharatah]

Iran went from 13 tones of 3.5% enriched uranium to 300 kg. It is clear what happened. There is no need to explain more.

What you said violates the laws of physics:

1- Destroying 13 tons of 3.5% uranium wouldn't cause a nuclear disaster, but:

- It would spread radioactive dust (long-term cancer risk).
- If it's UF6, it would be a chemical disaster (not nuclear).

And none of this happened, there's no evidence of any of this.

2 - If it wasn't destroyed, it's somewhere for a purpose...

////
No one knows what's happening in Iran's nuclear program now, as nuclear agency inspectors were expelled(and the cameras were turned off) on charges of spying for Israel. The agency itself has stated that it can't confirm what was destroyed or what wasn't, that it doesn't know what it has, and that it doesn't know where the enriched uranium is. The rest is Zionist nonsense.

 

[ShapurII]

What you said violates the laws of physics:

1- Destroying 13 tons of 3.5% uranium wouldn't cause a nuclear disaster, but:

- It would spread radioactive dust (long-term cancer risk).
- If it's UF6, it would be a chemical disaster (not nuclear).

And none of this happened, there's no evidence of any of this.

2 - If it wasn't destroyed, it's somewhere for a purpose...

////
No one knows what's happening in Iran's nuclear program now, as nuclear agency inspectors were expelled(and the cameras were turned off) on charges of spying for Israel. The agency itself has stated that it can't confirm what was destroyed or what wasn't, that it doesn't know what it has, and that it doesn't know where the enriched uranium is. The rest is Zionist nonsense.

I'm starting to believe that dude who said you were a troll. I give you the benefit of the doubt for one last time.

Iran sent 13 tons of 3.5% enriched uranium abroad under the JCPOA.

 

[shapurzolaktaf]

What accusations? They were all facts. And they were related to post-revolution Iran in the last 20-25 years. The fact that you have to return to 100 years ago to come up with completely irrelevant counter arguments shows that you have nothing to say on the topic. That proves you to be the triggered one here, trying to defend the undefendable. Tsarist Russia and Soviet Russia annexed one-third of our territory. Why don't you talk about that if you want to go into our historical relations with Russia?

Russia has always been Iran's number 1 enemy throughout our history in the last 3 centuries.

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@1:37

I believe RT news is a state-owned Russian channel. When it says Khamenei graduated from there, do you think they are lying? OK. Let's assume they are lying. Why doesn't Iran summon the Russian ambassador over that? They are spreading rumors about our leader. That shouldn't go unpunished.

Don't bend over for Russians. They are the most evil nation on the face of the planet. Their history is full of evil deeds. In fact, the most evil Zionists are Slavs, mainly going there from Russia.

There is no Tsarist and Soviet Russia anymore. It's like saying ottomans empire captured kurdish parts of Iran, yes, but should Turkey be our worse enemy now?

You can go back 1000 years back, but after 1979 (Iran) and after 1991 (Russia) both countries got new administrations.

Ofcourse I'm talking about post revolution situation, it's more relevant and important and we have MORE peace and CANT be played against Russia anymore. If you are against this, it means you don't mind Iran playing Ukrainian or Georgian proxy-role, which is impossible because of 1979 revolution.

RT is the Russian FOX TV, click bait and nonsense. I proved you all these fake accusations were nonsense, so don't repeat them for the sake of your own reputation.

I expect this nonsense from bunch of old, blond-haired wheelchair-shitting shahollahi grandmothers, parroting Mossad-media ("Iran-International") and having not read a single book in their entire life.

Islamic republic supported Afghan Mujahedin to kill Russians and these Bahais and zionists are telling me Iran and Khamenei is puppet of Russia.

Don't worry, Iran is not bending for anyone and our hypersonic missles maimed & PTSD-ed some Russian jews for life during last attack.

Further I agree with you, we should go for nuclear weapons.

 

[ShapurII]

There is no Tsarist and Soviet Russia anymore. It's like saying ottomans empire captured kurdish parts of Iran, yes, but should Turkey be our worse enemy now?

You can go back 1000 years back, but after 1979 (Iran) and after 1991 (Russia) both countries got new administrations.

Ofcourse I'm talking about post revolution situation, it's more relevant and important and we have MORE peace and CANT be played against Russia anymore. If you are against this, it means you don't mind Iran playing Ukrainian or Georgian proxy-role, which is impossible because of 1979 revolution.

RT is the Russian FOX TV, click bait and nonsense. I proved you all these fake accusations were nonsense, so don't repeat them for the sake of your own reputation.

I expect this nonsense from bunch of old, blond-haired wheelchair-shitting shahollahi grandmothers, parroting Mossad-media ("Iran-International") and having not read a single book in their entire life.

Islamic republic supported Afghan Mujahedin to kill Russians and these Bahais and zionists are telling me Iran and Khamenei is puppet of Russia.

Don't worry, Iran is not bending for anyone and our hypersonic missles maimed & PTSD-ed some Russian jews for life during last attack.

You were the one who wanted to discuss 100 years ago. So, let's discuss it. But I know you don't want to because it proves that Russia has been our worst enemy in the last 3 CENTURIES.

Yes, we should be played by second-class power like Russia against the West. How wise! Really wise.

Islamic Republic was different back then. Khomeini wasn't a KGB agent, Khamenei is, as proved by ample evidence of how he prefers Russian interests over Iran's interests.

Yeah, and those Jews (who are an "almost-Russian speaking" nation, per Comrade Putin) bombed Iran worse than Gaza. They killed over 1,100 Iranians in 12 days. The average is higher than the people they have killed in an ongoing genocide campaign in Gaza.

 

[Khorasan Black Flags]

Our only way to get out of the current situation is nuclear deterrence. Iran is massively under-armed against the US and we need nuclear deterrence to guarantee our sovereignty.

You guys never listen to reason until it's too late. You were one of those people who said Israel would never dare to attack Iran, and not only it happened, but we all agree that it would restart soon.

This is a war over control of the most powerful nation on Earth with even China and Russia supporting them behind the scenes. You have to take everything into account instead of criticizing your country as a whole.

By the way, Iran is 1,648,195 km² in size — and who knows how many underground bases we have related to missile or nuclear capabilities

Yeah, probably our politicians are dumb — but our militarists are completely different

The Fourth Nuclear-Weapons-Related Testing Site Located: | ISIS Reports | Institute For Science And International Security

isis-online.org

Summary of Report: Project Midan: Building an Underground Nuclear Test Site in Iran [1] | ISIS Reports | Institute For Science And International Security

isis-online.org

The Plan: Iran’s Nuclear Archive Shows it Planned to Build Five Nuclear Weapons by mid-2003 | ISIS Reports | Institute For Science And International Security

isis-online.org

 

[ShapurII]

This is a war over control of the most powerful nation on Earth with even China and Russia supporting them behind the scenes. You have to take everything into account instead of criticizing your country as a whole.

By the way, Iran is 1,648,195 km² in size — and who knows how many underground bases we have related to missile or nuclear capabilities

All I can say is that nuclear deterrence for Iran is an issue of survival at this point.
I hope we would hear some good news by September, and I'm foolish optimistic about it even though all evidence seems to be against what I'd like to hear.

 

[Khorasan Black Flags]

All I can say is that nuclear deterrence for Iran is an issue of survival at this point.
I hope we would hear some good news by September, and I'm foolish optimistic about it even though all evidence seems to be against what I'd like to hear.

All of Iran's nuke efforts since 1990's have been secret