Scientists find genetic link between Attila’s Huns and Xiongnu empire that fought Han China

[MH.Yang]

The Huns and Mongolians do share a genetic ancestry with us. Culturally they aren't East Asian but genetically speaking Mongolians and Chinese are North Asiatic from the Siberian region who moved to the Yellow River region and began to have civilization.

So, we recognize the Huns as genetically East Asian, but not its culture as our brother. Bloodline aside, a little bit of Han blood from thousands of years ago could not have been stably passed on in the chaotic steppe. As for the Turkic peoples, neither their blood nor their culture belongs to East Asia.

 

[ety]

The Han Chinese controlled the Great Wall and blocked trade and intelligence from the steppe peoples. That caused the steppe peoples of East Asia to lack salt, tea (to supplement vitamin C and avoid sepsis), metalwork, and almost all other necessities of life. Also, the Han Chinese often used the Great Wall to cover up army movements and frequently attacked the unsuspecting steppe peoples. This led to the extremely poor living conditions of the steppe peoples. 1949 China's first census, the life expectancy of the nomadic herders on the Mongolian steppe at that time was only 19.8 years old. It can be seen that the life expectancy of nomads in ancient times was only shorter.
It was difficult enough to keep the tribe alive in such a harsh environment. Apart from the Hun royal family, it was impossible for other Hun nomads to maintain the integrity and purity of their bloodline.

In general, the royal court of the Huns was in the Loop region of China. In the third century B.C., the first complete and unified Han empire (the Qin dynasty) was about to emerge and made no secret of its hostility to the steppes. And at that time almost all of the East Asian steppe tribes chose to join the king of the Xiongnu in order to cope with the Han people that was about to enter the age of empire. This is the original story of the Han people and his thousand year old mortal enemy.

Whereas the royal Ashina family of the Turkic people came from the Outer Mongolian steppe, the Turkic tribes were a collection of nomadic people from the Altai Mountains. So it was a Central and North Asian nation, not an East Asian nation.

I think Huns and Xiongnu were significantly different. Xinangnu were probably mostly of East Asian stocks, genetically(esp the aristocrats) somewhat related to Chinese, they lived in Asia steppes. But, Huns were more of Eurasian stocks, they lived in Central Asia and Eastern Europe, they appeared few hundred years later than Xiangnu in history. In a way, Huns albeit mixed with some Europeans were the descendants of Xiangnu people.

 

[MH.Yang]

I think Huns and Xiongnu were significantly different. Xinangnu were probably mostly of East Asian stocks, genetically(esp the aristocrats) somewhat related to Chinese, they lived in Asia steppes. But, Huns were more of Eurasian stocks, they lived in Central Asia and Eastern Europe, they appeared few hundred years later than Xiangnu in history. In a way, Huns albeit mixed with some Europeans were the descendants of Xiangnu people.

Yes. The harsh conditions of the steppe made it impossible to keep the bloodline pure unless one was a noble. Some nobles of the steppe tribes may have ancestors who were Han Chinese who fled to the steppe, but that doesn't mean that the tribe he leads is related to the Han Chinese. After all, the population of the nobles was so small that their Han genes were unrepresentative of the huge tribal population.

 

[Waz]

The soldiers and elites married/raped the local women and were assimilated, that's why in Russia, Central Asia and Eastern Europe, you can see Mongol admixture. The modern Turks are simply Greeks/Italians who submitted to Turko-Mongol culture and claimed it as their own. Turco-mongols eventhough genetically related to us are our sworn enemies for millenias, and the Han People managed to destroy them multiple times to ensure the survival of the Chinese Civilization. Their culture is very different from ours, we treasure literature, they treasure violence.

Yes that is correct.
Although I don't see it in Eastern Europe as such. It's more prevalent in Central Asia and becomes stronger the closer you get to the Altai region.
Modern Turks are a mix of people and not just simply Europeans who adopted the Turkic culture.

 

[Waz]

The Huns and Mongolians do share a genetic ancestry with us. Culturally they aren't East Asian but genetically speaking Mongolians and Chinese are North Asiatic from the Siberian region who moved to the Yellow River region and began to have civilization.

Northern Han Chinese are more closely related to Mongols due to geographic proximity, while southern Han Chinese have more genetic influences from southern indigenous groups.
Mongols are a nomadic people with genetic influences from Siberian, Turkic, and other Central Asian populations, which was reflected in my own testing, East Asian came up as well ( Hazara). Whereas Han Chinese have stronger genetic ties to ancient agricultural civilizations in the Yellow River basin.

 

[Maira La]

while southern Han Chinese have more genetic influences from southern indigenous groups.

Yeah exactly, check this out.


The southern coastal Chinese have 32.2 % Austronesian whereas the Northern ones from Shanxi province have only 5.6% of it.

Mongols have Afanasievo (IE migrants form Pontic-Caspian Steppe) and southern Siberian type DNA that the Chinese mostly don't have. The Northern ones have tiny amounts because of gene flow from Mongols.

 

[MH.Yang]

Northern Han Chinese are more closely related to Mongols due to geographic proximity, while southern Han Chinese have more genetic influences from southern indigenous groups.
Mongols are a nomadic people with genetic influences from Siberian, Turkic, and other Central Asian populations, which was reflected in my own testing, East Asian came up as well ( Hazara). Whereas Han Chinese have stronger genetic ties to ancient agricultural civilizations in the Yellow River basin.

A person who wanted to survive in the harsh steppe environment needed to be relatively well-rounded. He needs to be able to fight, herd animals, make clothes and food, etc. Therefore, nomads respect those who are strong and courageous and who solve problems with violence.

Agrarian civilization does not require people to know all the skills. Agrarian civilized societies had a careful division of work, and each person just needed to concentrate on his or her own work. The division of labor required a stable social order, and those who relied on personal force to disrupt the order were inherently rejected by agrarian civilizations.

These two civilizations were destined to be enemies, not friends, from the beginning.

 

[Han Patriot]

Northern Han Chinese are more closely related to Mongols due to geographic proximity, while southern Han Chinese have more genetic influences from southern indigenous groups.
Mongols are a nomadic people with genetic influences from Siberian, Turkic, and other Central Asian populations, which was reflected in my own testing, East Asian came up as well ( Hazara). Whereas Han Chinese have stronger genetic ties to ancient agricultural civilizations in the Yellow River basin.

Yes, the original Han Chinese aka the slanted eye tribe were genetically selected in the Siberian region, slanted eyes due to the extreme cold and ice reflection, it is a genetic adaptation. They moved south, one became nomad in the steppes (Mongolians/Huns/Turks), another went to the Yellow River region and created the first Han Civilization. As they moved south to colonised new lands, they mixed with the local Austronesian brown races and created the modern day Southern Han people.

 

[mythbuster]

Yeah exactly, check this out.
View attachment 106184

The southern coastal Chinese have 32.2 % Austronesian whereas the Northern ones from Shanxi province have only 5.6% of it.

Mongols have Afanasievo (IE migrants form Pontic-Caspian Steppe) and southern Siberian type DNA that the Chinese mostly don't have. The Northern ones have tiny amounts because of gene flow from Mongols.

Than why are East Asians called mongoloids ?

 

[MH.Yang]

Than why are East Asians called mongoloids ?

Nonsense. Mongolia is the outlier in East Asia, Mongolia should go to Central Asia and Vietnam and Singapore should join East Asia even more.

 

[Maira La]

Than why are East Asians called mongoloids ?

"Mongoloids" is an old pseudo science term to refer to all East Asian people as a single race. Mongols on the other hand refers to a particular ethnicity in and around Mongolia.

 

[ety]

Than why are East Asians called mongoloids ?

Because Westerners/Europeans were awed by the historical Mongol empire impacted on Europe or West, so they came to call all the people Mongoloids that have sort of similar physical appearances living in the regions around Mongolia.

 

[Nan Yang]

AI Overview

• Primary source:
  The "Book of Han" is considered the most important source for information regarding the Xiongnu, documenting their conflicts with the Han dynasty and their westward movements.

According to Sogdian records, the westward movement of the Western Xiongnu, a nomadic group from Central Asia, is documented through letters and other texts written by Sogdian merchants who lived along the Silk Road, detailing the plundering and movement of these nomadic tribes across the region, often connecting them with the later "Huns" mentioned in other historical sources.
Key points about the Sogdian records of the Western Xiongnu migration:

Trade routes and information flow:
Sogdians, known for their extensive trade network along the Silk Road, were well-positioned to observe and record the movements of nomadic groups like the Xiongnu.

Linguistic connection:
Sogdian texts often used terms like "Xwn" to refer to the Xiongnu, which is considered a linguistic link to the "Huns" mentioned in other historical accounts.

Impact on Central Asia:
The Sogdian records document the disruption caused by the westward migration of the Xiongnu, including raids on settlements and the displacement of local populations.

 

[Waz]

Yeah exactly, check this out.
View attachment 106184

The southern coastal Chinese have 32.2 % Austronesian whereas the Northern ones from Shanxi province have only 5.6% of it.

Mongols have Afanasievo (IE migrants form Pontic-Caspian Steppe) and southern Siberian type DNA that the Chinese mostly don't have. The Northern ones have tiny amounts because of gene flow from Mongols.

Yes makes sense with other DNA testing, thank you bro.

 

[Waz]

A person who wanted to survive in the harsh steppe environment needed to be relatively well-rounded. He needs to be able to fight, herd animals, make clothes and food, etc. Therefore, nomads respect those who are strong and courageous and who solve problems with violence.

Agrarian civilization does not require people to know all the skills. Agrarian civilized societies had a careful division of work, and each person just needed to concentrate on his or her own work. The division of labor required a stable social order, and those who relied on personal force to disrupt the order were inherently rejected by agrarian civilizations.

These two civilizations were destined to be enemies, not friends, from the beginning.

You are right and those traits characterise both populations well. Essentially different skills sets. However there are blurred lines as well. Nomadic populations also had to be excellent at diplomacy to avoid continues war, forged alliances were common among the steppe. Disputes regarding farmed land were plenty in both the ancient world and modern world. Both societies can be inherently peaceful as well, as shown by crime statistics.