PA MLRS, Self Propelled and towed artillery [BM-11, Fatah-I GMLRS, Fatah-II] - News, Updates & Discussions

[Toxic]

Why are you making facts out of thin air? Who told you this stupid figure of 10/month?

My own analysis based on what users that are on "inside" Have said we are adding roughly a regiment of Fatah 1 per year, each regiment has 18 TELs with 8 missiles each, which gives us a figure of 144 missiles or 12 per month

Of course somebody like @Panzerkiel or @farooqbhai can correct me If I am wrong.

 

[diaspora]

From your own source WS-2 is a 400mm rocket while Fatah-1 is a 300mm rocket.
View attachment 196438
View attachment 196439
And from which retarded angle are these two the same?

Their noseconemes at

Check this out

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We're back to flak cannons from World War 2. What a time to be alive lol.

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[ThoroughPro]

View attachment 196363
the only j20 that we can get and afford

you will be surprised.

 

[ThoroughPro]

This has been Pakistan’s modus operandi over the last decade or so.

A case in point is Guangdong Hongda, the company that developed this missile is primarily a Chinese mining company.

Pakistan often purchases off-the-shelf missiles and drones from private Chinese firms — most of these products are neither used by the PLA nor widely exported internationally.

These systems are then rebranded as Fateh, Nasr, Faaz, Burraq, Shahpar, etc., and presented as indigenously developed products of GIDS, NESCOM, etc. to fool the common people.

Would Indians be heart broken if a Chinese missile killed them?
Would they re-born a better person if a Pakistani missile killed them?
We really don't care as long as it destroys the target it was fired at and roasts some smelly creatures.

 

[ThoroughPro]

Pakistan is a partner in beidou program. And has access to military grade signals from the system.
Why do you think Beidou will atop being available?

Have a look at this PDF file

Pakistan has no partnership in Beidu system, we might be a client of military grade services though.

 

[ThoroughPro]

What's the range of the Fatah 3s???

Their seem to be different stats saying different things

depends on the version and the warhead size.

 

[Mujahid]

View attachment 196327
and as always the mandotry fuckup by ISPR , they Mislabeled shahpar 2 as 3
View attachment 196328
noticed by @Ak01

These faujeets believe that awam is chutiya..

 

[Cipher212]

This has been Pakistan’s modus operandi over the last decade or so.

A case in point is Guangdong Hongda, the company that developed this missile is primarily a Chinese mining company.

Pakistan often purchases off-the-shelf missiles and drones from private Chinese firms — most of these products are neither used by the PLA nor widely exported internationally.

These systems are then rebranded as Fateh, Nasr, Faaz, Burraq, Shahpar, etc., and presented as indigenously developed products of GIDS, NESCOM, etc. to fool the common people.

Literally nobody gives a shit if the weapons are designed by a Chinese company or totally by Pakistan. All that matters is getting the ToT and steady supply of said weapon, which we do.

 

[falcon34]

My own analysis based on what users that are on "inside" Have said we are adding roughly a regiment of Fatah 1 per year, each regiment has 18 TELs with 8 missiles each, which gives us a figure of 144 missiles or 12 per month

Of course somebody like @Panzerkiel or @farooqbhai can correct me If I am wrong.

You think they won't be making at least 2-3 reloads for regiment?

 

[ThoroughPro]

@Oscar

What's your analysis on this new HD-1/Fatah III missiles?

Hypersonic? Guidance is INS/Beidou/GPS? How capable it is, where and how can it be employed? Effects on Indian AD posture and capability?

Your thoughts please.

I believe that none of our new (and may be old ones too) weapon system uses GPS for guidance anymore. We switched to Beidu long time ago because it will be available to guide our weapons during a conflict (unlike GPS), offers much higher accuracy compared to GPS, resistant to jamming and spoofing and we get military grade services not the commercial grade services of GPS.

 

[ThoroughPro]

You think they won't be making at least 2-3 reloads for regiment?

no one knows the numbers and no one discloses the numbers, USA lost the war to Iran because their estimates of Iranian missile numbers were wrong. This is how critical the numbers are and that is why they are guarded secrets.

 

[SaltFlats]

Would Indians be heart broken if a Chinese missile killed them?
Would they re-born a better person if a Pakistani missile killed them?
We really don't care as long as it destroys the target it was fired at and roasts some smelly creatures.

on that note, I just felt like leaving this here

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[Oscar]

@Oscar

What's your analysis on this new HD-1/Fatah III missiles?

Hypersonic? Guidance is INS/Beidou/GPS? How capable it is, where and how can it be employed? Effects on Indian AD posture and capability?

Your thoughts please.

It is a Mach 2+ system capable of 5-10m attitudes at terminal attack but in general will do around 5-10k for cruise or a Hi-Hi-lo or Hi-Lo-lo at reduced range and speed because at those speeds it has to undergo a lot of dynamic pressure to change altitudes.

Also why it is a heavy system with the air launched at 2 tons(removing JF-17 entirely out of the mix as a launch platform) and ground launched versions are even heavier.
Lets do a comparison to Brahmos at risk of Bhaktora fanboys flooding the thread.


So it is less sophisticated but that does not mean Brahmos is automatically unreliable because that system is based off a long lineage in the proven Oniks versus the HD-1 is still not "battle tested" so to speak from a repeated launch aspect.

There are also differrences in propulsion - Brahmos is liquid fuel for which India had to set up a facility to produce and also storage that suits those requirements. This gives it a longer range due to efficiency from liquid fuel and better control but then you are also getting a complex missile with more pipes, valves and so on.

The HD-1 is solid fuel so you get less range from a similar mass but then it is easier(and cheaper) to produce along with much simpler storage systems which still getting 70-80% of the efficiency and control that Brahmos has.

However, that also means that likely from a cost perspective it provides Pakistan an immediate "simile" the missing capability it had in that specific vector and cheaper to procure considering the impact of cost has ten times more impact to Pakistan than India.

No side is "wrong" in their choice - India has its operational needs which go beyond land to multi domain common architecture which rewards them at their scale.
Pakistan gets a faster scaling system without deep infrastructure investment but has more limits to the system's overall performance.

 

[Toxic]

It is a Mach 2+ system capable of 5-10m attitudes at terminal attack but in general will do around 5-10k for cruise or a Hi-Hi-lo or Hi-Lo-lo at reduced range and speed because at those speeds it has to undergo a lot of dynamic pressure to change altitudes.

Also why it is a heavy system with the air launched at 2 tons(removing JF-17 entirely out of the mix as a launch platform) and ground launched versions are even heavier.
Lets do a comparison to Brahmos at risk of Bhaktora fanboys flooding the thread.


So it is less sophisticated but that does not mean Brahmos is automatically unreliable because that system is based off a long lineage in the proven Oniks versus the HD-1 is still not "battle tested" so to speak from a repeated launch aspect.

There are also differrences in propulsion - Brahmos is liquid fuel for which India had to set up a facility to produce and also storage that suits those requirements. This gives it a longer range due to efficiency from liquid fuel and better control but then you are also getting a complex missile with more pipes, valves and so on.

The HD-1 is solid fuel so you get less range from a similar mass but then it is easier(and cheaper) to produce along with much simpler storage systems which still getting 70-80% of the efficiency and control that Brahmos has.

However, that also means that likely from a cost perspective it provides Pakistan an immediate "simile" the missing capability it had in that specific vector and cheaper to procure considering the impact of cost has ten times more impact to Pakistan than India.

No side is "wrong" in their choice - India has its operational needs which go beyond land to multi domain common architecture which rewards them at their scale.
Pakistan gets a faster scaling system without deep infrastructure investment but has more limits to the system's overall performance.

The air launched version of the missile weighs 1200KG or 1.2 tonnes which means it can be carried by the JF-17 on either the center or inner pylons.

the OEM showcased a model of JF-17 and Mirage 3/5 carrying 2 of these, now you could say they were being a bit too optimistic but considering the JF-17 can carry two 1200L drop tanks so I don't think there is any reason to doubt it can carry two of these (although not very practical due to the drag penalty.

 

[Sparten]

Also why it is a heavy system with the air launched at 2 tons(removing JF-17 entirely out of the mix as a launch platform) and ground launched versions are even heavier.
Lets do a comparison to Brahmos at risk of Bhaktora fanboys flooding the thread.

The JF17 can carry it. It will need some modification and probably take off with a reduced fuel load and top off from tankers.
(Yes, whether it can land safely is a good question).