Bangladesh celebrates 54th Independence Day today

The topic of Bangladesh and bengali as a people seems more complicated to me today, than it was when i was a child. When the world around me seemed much more simple and settled.
We are a people divided on artificial borders. Made by men who was born and lived in world very different from now.

I think many punjabis also might share a smilar feeling.
Because we all are putting religion above the culture and it is as simple as that. I guess we value afterlife more than present one. And than for religious, atheist and agnostics there is greed and lust for power.


We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.
Charles Bukowski

Listen to this masterpiece by Sudarshan Faakir, sung by Jagjeet Singh


Anyhow, Congratulations to Bangladesh on independence day and wishing you best for future !!
 
The topic of Bangladesh and bengali as a people seems more complicated to me today, than it was when i was a child. When the world around me seemed much more simple and settled.
We are a people divided on artificial borders. Made by men who was born and lived in world very different from now.

I think many punjabis also might share a smilar feeling.

Yeah, because it is actually complicated. Bengali is an ethnic identity while being Bangladeshi is a nationality. People's Republic of Bangladesh is a nation state. We have tiny ethnic minorities who are equally Bangladeshi.

It is a good thing not to base your identity on ethno-nationalism. Even though Bengali nationalism wasn't toxic like many other similar movements in the past and was mostly positive, (I am happy for that,) still you don't take chance with it today. Also, by definition ethno-nationalism is exclusive and not compatible with 21th century standard.

I am all for celebrating our cultural and linguistic similarities with West Bengalis. But can't mix it with politics.
 
Yeah, because it is actually complicated. Bengali is an ethnic identity while being Bangladeshi is a nationality. People's Republic of Bangladesh is a nation state. We have tiny ethnic minorities who are equally Bangladeshi.

It is a good thing not to base your identity on ethno-nationalism. Even though Bengali nationalism wasn't toxic like many others similar movements in the past, still you don't take chance with it. Also, by definition ethno-nationalism is exclusive and not compatible with 21th century standard.

I am all for celebrating our cultural and linguistic similarities with West Bengalis. But can't mix it with politics.

Yes

This is the crux of the matter.
Because in reality there is no clear cut lines between ethnicity. All cultures and ethnicities exist on a continuum. Humans are genetically more alike than two gorillas from the same forest.

We are all both benefactor or victims of men of power; depending on how you want to look at it.
 
The topic of Bangladesh and bengali as a people seems more complicated to me today, than it was when i was a child. When the world around me seemed much more simple and settled.
We are a people divided on artificial borders. Made by men who was born and lived in world very different from now.

I think many punjabis also might share a smilar feeling.
You know about the Suhrawardy-Sarat Bose-Kiron Shankar Rai plan, I am sure.
 
Yeah, because it is actually complicated. Bengali is an ethnic identity while being Bangladeshi is a nationality. People's Republic of Bangladesh is a nation state. We have tiny ethnic minorities who are equally Bangladeshi.

It is a good thing not to base your identity on ethno-nationalism. Even though Bengali nationalism wasn't toxic like many other similar movements in the past and was mostly positive, (I am happy for that,) still you don't take chance with it today. Also, by definition ethno-nationalism is exclusive and not compatible with 21th century standard.

I am all for celebrating our cultural and linguistic similarities with West Bengalis. But can't mix it with politics.
On this, we need to remember that the political divides in Greater Bengal very closely follow the boundaries of Bengali dialects. So Bangladesh contains Dhakai (Barisali included? my mamabari people will kill me!), Chatgaiyan, Sylheti and parts of Barendra; the other parts, very small parts, have gone into West Bengal.

West Bengal is a mix of caste and dialect.

It has Rarhi and some very local dialects, especially in the Chhota Nagpur and Sundarban areas. It also became separate because of the existence of a caste known as Mahishyas, or Kaivartas; both Jele Kaivarta and Chasha Kaivarta are very strong in the countryside, and it was their influence, not that of the usual Brahmin-Baidya-Kayastha grouping that influenced the decision to stay away, egged on by Syama Prasad Mukherjee's very active promotion of partition.
 
All cultures and ethnicities exist on a continuum. Humans are genetically more alike than two gorillas from the same forest.
Very true. If you look at the way Bengali is spoken, you can draw a line from Medinipur to Kachhar, and see how the language changes, in a very systematic way. It was just that the British, with their base in the Hooghly River, found that the people who were there to guide them into Bengali language and culture were Nadia Pandits, who managed to convince the Sahebs that their dialect was the standard.

Completely no basis in that.
 
Unfortunately not.
What was it?
Well, Suhrawardy has a bad reputation among Bengalis because of the mishandling of Direct Action Day, 16th August 1946, when he, as Prime Minister (the heads of provinces were then called Prime Minister) sat in the police control room and interfered with police action to quell rioting.

However, as a sometime disciple of Sher-e-Bangal Fazlul Huq, that great Bengali leader from Barisal who was sabotaged by the British administration in his ministry making efforts, Suhrawardy had earned respect as the head of the Muslim League in Bengal. People have the impression that Jinnah had absolute control over the Muslim League everywhere in India, but this was not true. There was no one to challenge Suhrawardy in Bengal.

So when it became clear that the British would hand over power to two Dominions, Pakistan and India, Suhrawardy felt uncomfortable. He got together with Netaji's elder brother, Sarat Bose, and another prominent Bengali politician from the Congress, and proposed to all that Bengal should be the undivided third Dominion. Jinnah, in exasperation and irritation told him that he and his friends were free to do what they liked,

It was here that Syama Prasad Mukherjee, the Congress leader who had left to lead the Hindu Mahasabha, a man far more powerful in those days than the riff-raff that the Sangh Parivar puts up as its leadership at that time, stepped in. He protested sharply to Nehru and to Patel, and they immediately bore down heavily on Sarat Bose and Kiran Shankar Rai and forced them to withdraw and to agree on a referendum for partition. The results were clear; the Hindu members voted for partition, the Muslim members opposed it, and the British decided that partition would be the wisest option.

So, but for Syama Prasad, there would have been a Dominion of Bengal, right from the outset, from 1947, and that Dominion would have suffered none of the oppression that it did for 24 years.
 
Well, Suhrawardy has a bad reputation among Bengalis because of the mishandling of Direct Action Day, 16th August 1946, when he, as Prime Minister (the heads of provinces were then called Prime Minister) sat in the police control room and interfered with police action to quell rioting.

However, as a sometime disciple of Sher-e-Bangal Fazlul Huq, that great Bengali leader from Barisal who was sabotaged by the British administration in his ministry making efforts, Suhrawardy had earned respect as the head of the Muslim League in Bengal. People have the impression that Jinnah had absolute control over the Muslim League everywhere in India, but this was not true. There was no one to challenge Suhrawardy in Bengal.

So when it became clear that the British would hand over power to two Dominions, Pakistan and India, Suhrawardy felt uncomfortable. He got together with Netaji's elder brother, Sarat Bose, and another prominent Bengali politician from the Congress, and proposed to all that Bengal should be the undivided third Dominion. Jinnah, in exasperation and irritation told him that he and his friends were free to do what they liked,

It was here that Syama Prasad Mukherjee, the Congress leader who had left to lead the Hindu Mahasabha, a man far more powerful in those days than the riff-raff that the Sangh Parivar puts up as its leadership at that time, stepped in. He protested sharply to Nehru and to Patel, and they immediately bore down heavily on Sarat Bose and Kiran Shankar Rai and forced them to withdraw and to agree on a referendum for partition. The results were clear; the Hindu members voted for partition, the Muslim members opposed it, and the British decided that partition would be the wisest option.

So, but for Syama Prasad, there would have been a Dominion of Bengal, right from the outset, from 1947, and that Dominion would have suffered none of the oppression that it did for 24 years.

Interesting

Syama Prasad Mukherjee
Why am i starting to dislike this guy.
Dumbass remind me of the scots who voted against independence from The UK.
 
Happy Independence Day. Yes we Pakistanis we unfair to Bangladeshis.

But as Muslims we should forgive each other and move on.

Yes
Luckily most Bangladeshis no longer hold any grudge against Pakistan.
 
Interesting

Syama Prasad Mukherjee
Why am i starting to dislike this guy.
Dumbass remind me of the scots who voted against independence from The UK.
Extremely worthy of dislike.
Utterly brilliant intellect, not a phony like Savarkar, but bigoted and while not quite Islamophobic, in the sense that we define it now, was very Hindu centric.
 
@Joe Shearer

Dada,

You know about the Suhrawardy-Sarat Bose-Kiron Shankar Rai plan, I am sure.

And you would recall my juicy dramatisation of how the plan was brought to nought.

Regards
 

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