Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

[Irfan Usmani 1977]

That is BS canard was proposed for 6th G US plane, Rafale, Typhoon use canard. How can su-mkk be stealthy use your logic!

They're all 4.5th gen jets not a stealth jets like F-22/F35/Su-57/J20 and there's no confirmation that USN 6th gen jet will have canards this is only Boeing company proposal to have canards on their upcoming F/A XX, let USN and pentagon decide that their upcoming 6th gen F/A XX needs a canards or not and btw USAF version NGAD will have no canards at all, it's just a Boeing proposal to USN

 

[Michael]

What's your source brother

Oh.Bro...
PAF has published the performance specifications for the J10C and WS10B. You can compare it with the F119 data. The WS10C is an upgraded model of the WS10B............ According to the analysis of some experts in the United States media, the thrust of the WS10C is about 91% of that of the F119. Of course, this is their speculation.

Equipped with the first-generation WS15, the J20 has been successfully flight tested many years ago. After the completion of that flight test, the J20 equipped with the WS10C began mass production. WS15 goes into silence............... It was only recently that the news of the J20 equipped with the latest generation WS15 was released again..........

I often emphasize that if you like to study China's military, you need to know something about Chinese culture. The logic of Chinese thinking is different from that of the West.

China does not officially publish precise data on these equipment. Even for export-oriented equipment at air shows, those data are only approximate data, not real and accurate data.

However, the WS10C has been massively equipped with the army, and you can make some basic judgments from the flight videos of these WS10C-equipped fighters. Of course, if you can understand these things.

I won't provide any proof!

 

[Irfan Usmani 1977]

Oh.Bro...
PAF has published the performance specifications for the J10C and WS10B. You can compare it with the F119 data. The WS10C is an upgraded model of the WS10B............ According to the analysis of some experts in the United States media, the thrust of the WS10C is about 91% of that of the F119. Of course, this is their speculation.

Equipped with the first-generation WS15, the J20 has been successfully flight tested many years ago. After the completion of that flight test, the J20 equipped with the WS10C began mass production. WS15 goes into silence............... It was only recently that the news of the J20 equipped with the latest generation WS15 was released again..........

I often emphasize that if you like to study China's military, you need to know something about Chinese culture. The logic of Chinese thinking is different from that of the West.

China does not officially publish precise data on these equipment. Even for export-oriented equipment at air shows, those data are only approximate data, not real and accurate data.

However, the WS10C has been massively equipped with the army, and you can make some basic judgments from the flight videos of these WS10C-equipped fighters. Of course, if you can understand these things.

I won't provide any proof!

Brother no one provide actual data of their weapons on social media other than potential customers and why you think F119 have thrust of 35.000 lbf, it's also just a speculation from various experts

And thrust is not all things you need to know how reliable your engine is compare to others, west has a vast experience to design and develop turbofan Engines since at least early 70s and your first turbofan project (WS10) just started in late 80s, you're just a beginner of jet engine development fields in compare to west

 

[Michael]

And thrust is not all things you need to know how reliable your engine is compare to others, west has a vast experience to design and develop turbofan Engines since at least early 70s and your first turbofan project (WS10) just started in late 80s, you're just a beginner of jet engine development fields in compare to west

So, I think your thinking logic needs some adjustment.

In science and technology, you can't judge that way.

Turbofan engine technology was indeed designed and manufactured many years ago in Western countries, and they have a lot of experience. China started very late in this field and is currently in the learning and catch-up phase. No one denies this.

But you can't conclude from this: Chinese turbofan engines are certainly not as good as Western turbofan engines. Facts have proved that in the catch-up of the Chinese in recent decades, many areas of traditional superiority of Western countries have been surpassed by the Chinese. For example, ultra-high voltage power transmission, high-speed rail, clean energy........ These areas were all started earlier by Western countries, but now they have been completely surpassed by China.

I think that in the field of turbofan engines, China is trying to catch up with Western countries. In some details, it may be behind, it may be ahead. It doesn't matter. Importantly, we are trying to catch up and surpass.

 

[Hendarto]

Brother no one provide actual data of their weapons on social media other than potential customers and why you think F119 have thrust of 35.000 lbf, it's also just a speculation from various experts

And thrust is not all things you need to know how reliable your engine is compare to others, west has a vast experience to design and develop turbofan Engines since at least early 70s and your first turbofan project (WS10) just started in late 80s, you're just a beginner of jet engine development fields in compare to west

Yup, Boeing has vast experience in designing passenger jets But they have been making turkey jets lately. Xerox went bankrupt and so Did Kodak. so what does experience have to do with making a good product? China could not make a single car in the 80s Yet today she is the biggest car exporter in the world. Ditto with HSR and solar panels. Wind turbines, ships of all kinds, Telecommunication. You are just biased and worshipped the West! And can't accept that China now surpassed the West in most fields It is confirmed by ASPI
BTW F35 is a fiasco and still not in mass production after 30 years

China now global leader in 90% of critical tech research: think tank

AUKUS encouraged to join forces with Japan and South Korea to close gap

asia.nikkei.com

China now global leader in 90% of critical tech research: think tank​

AUKUS encouraged to join forces with Japan and South Korea to close gap

China holds a wide lead in research on advanced aircraft engines, among other areas, according to the Australian Strategic Policy Institute's Critical Technology Tracker. © Reuters
SHOGO KODAMA and MASAYA KATO, Nikkei staff writersAugust 29, 2024 02:33 JST
TOKYO -- China is the top research nation in the vast majority of advanced technologies, according to a new study by an Australian think tank that calls on the U.S. and its Asian allies to work together to catch up.

The government-backed Australian Strategic Policy Institute's (ASPI) Critical Technology Tracker assesses countries' research competitiveness based on the number of research paper citations in 64 technology categories. China grabbed the top spot in 57 areas, or nearly 90%, for papers released between 2019 and 2023, according to a report released Wednesday.

This represents a turnaround from the 2003-2007 period, when the U.S. led in 60 out of 64 categories, while China topped just three. For 2019-2023, the U.S. ranked first in just seven categories, including quantum computing and biotechnology, gene technologies and vaccines

In particular, China has made strides in dual-use technologies that have possible military applications. There are 24 categories classified as being at high risk of being monopolized by a country, including radar, satellite positioning and drones.

When it comes to citations related to hypersonic detection and tracking, China has a 73% share, the U.S. has 13% and the U.K. 3%. For advanced aircraft engines, China leads with 63% while the U.S. trails at 7%.

 

[Irfan Usmani 1977]

Yup, Boeing has vast experience in designing passenger jets But they have been making turkey jets lately. Xerox went bankrupt and so Did Kodak. so what does experience have to do with making a good product? China could not make a single car in the 80s Yet today she is the biggest car exporter in the world. Ditto with HSR and solar panels. Wind turbines, ships of all kinds, Telecommunication. You are just biased and worshipped the West! And can't accept that China now surpassed the West in most fields It is confirmed by ASPI
BTW F35 is a fiasco and still not in mass production after 30 years

China now global leader in 90% of critical tech research: think tank

AUKUS encouraged to join forces with Japan and South Korea to close gap

asia.nikkei.com

China now global leader in 90% of critical tech research: think tank​

AUKUS encouraged to join forces with Japan and South Korea to close gap

China holds a wide lead in research on advanced aircraft engines, among other areas, according to the Australian Strategic Policy Institute's Critical Technology Tracker. © Reuters
SHOGO KODAMA and MASAYA KATO, Nikkei staff writersAugust 29, 2024 02:33 JST
TOKYO -- China is the top research nation in the vast majority of advanced technologies, according to a new study by an Australian think tank that calls on the U.S. and its Asian allies to work together to catch up.

The government-backed Australian Strategic Policy Institute's (ASPI) Critical Technology Tracker assesses countries' research competitiveness based on the number of research paper citations in 64 technology categories. China grabbed the top spot in 57 areas, or nearly 90%, for papers released between 2019 and 2023, according to a report released Wednesday.

This represents a turnaround from the 2003-2007 period, when the U.S. led in 60 out of 64 categories, while China topped just three. For 2019-2023, the U.S. ranked first in just seven categories, including quantum computing and biotechnology, gene technologies and vaccines

In particular, China has made strides in dual-use technologies that have possible military applications. There are 24 categories classified as being at high risk of being monopolized by a country, including radar, satellite positioning and drones.

When it comes to citations related to hypersonic detection and tracking, China has a 73% share, the U.S. has 13% and the U.K. 3%. For advanced aircraft engines, China leads with 63% while the U.S. trails at 7%.

You mixing things up I'm not talking about civilian technologies but military one its often top secret and most highest and classified technologies and west Don't sitting idle either they have developed HSR (French TGV)and other technologies lot earlier than you but not adopted these technologies to their countries because their thinking and culture is different and you're only adopting these technologies because you have large population

 

[BonitoBoy]

I don't know too much about engine but yeah they should be comparable is what I'm trying to say.

Not just Comparable but Considerable too imo.

 

[Michael]

You mixing things up I'm not talking about civilian technologies but military one its often top secret and most highest and classified technologies and west Don't sitting idle either they have developed HSR (French TGV)and other technologies lot earlier than you but not adopted these technologies to their countries because their thinking and culture is different and you're only adopting these technologies because you have large population

The technologies we are talking about are all applied technologies. Whether it is a military or civilian technology, it must be widely used in practice before it can be judged.

It is true that China's high-speed rail technology did come from France and Japan, and no one can deny it. But today, by any angle, China's high-speed rail has far surpassed France and Japan. Actual operating speed, safety and comfort, operating mileage............ Of course, it also includes the ability of high-speed rail to operate in various meteorological and geographical environments. It may be that France or Japan are still ahead in some detail, but that doesn't prevent people from putting China's high-speed rail in the first place. If France has more and more advanced high-speed rail technology, it needs to be practiced.

Just like China's arms trade, many friends believe that China's weapons have not been tested in actual combat and cannot prove their combat capabilities. It's a fact.

As a matter of fact, the products that China sells relatively well in the international arms trade have all been tested in actual combat. Early imitation AK, Type 59 tank.............. The current Wing Loong UAV..............

The United States is the world's largest arms exporter because they have been using wars to prove their weapons and then sell their weapons.

If, one day in the future, China starts a war, China's weapons will be put to good use in actual combat. I am confident that China's arms trade will develop at an unimaginable pace. But I don't want to see it.

 

[Irfan Usmani 1977]

The technologies we are talking about are all applied technologies. Whether it is a military or civilian technology, it must be widely used in practice before it can be judged.

It is true that China's high-speed rail technology did come from France and Japan, and no one can deny it. But today, by any angle, China's high-speed rail has far surpassed France and Japan. Actual operating speed, safety and comfort, operating mileage............ Of course, it also includes the ability of high-speed rail to operate in various meteorological and geographical environments. It may be that France or Japan are still ahead in some detail, but that doesn't prevent people from putting China's high-speed rail in the first place. If France has more and more advanced high-speed rail technology, it needs to be practiced.

Just like China's arms trade, many friends believe that China's weapons have not been tested in actual combat and cannot prove their combat capabilities. It's a fact.

As a matter of fact, the products that China sells relatively well in the international arms trade have all been tested in actual combat. Early imitation AK, Type 59 tank.............. The current Wing Loong UAV..............

The United States is the world's largest arms exporter because they have been using wars to prove their weapons and then sell their weapons.

If, one day in the future, China starts a war, China's weapons will be put to good use in actual combat. I am confident that China's arms trade will develop at an unimaginable pace. But I don't want to see it.

I'm denying that Chinese arms are unreliable we proved JF-17 against weapons systems of EU/Israel/Russian and USA of India but in few fields like military jet engine development fields China still 15 to 20 years behind the west especially to the USA

 

[Michael]

I'm denying that Chinese arms are unreliable we proved JF-17 against weapons systems of EU/Israel/Russian and USA of India but in few fields like military jet engine development fields China still 15 to 20 years behind the west especially to the USA

I don't want to describe too much about the JF-17. Certain detailed descriptions can hurt the feelings of Pakistani friends.

===================

You need to understand: 15~20 years, what does it mean for China.
You can go and look up the data, the comparison of data between China and the United States 20 years ago, and the comparison of data between China and the United States today.
Let's wait until 20 years from now, and then look back at today's post.

As for the turbofan engine, let's be patient, there will be results soon.

 

[Irfan Usmani 1977]

I don't want to describe too much about the JF-17. Certain detailed descriptions can hurt the feelings of Pakistani friends.

===================

You need to understand: 15~20 years, what does it mean for China.
You can go and look up the data, the comparison of data between China and the United States 20 years ago, and the comparison of data between China and the United States today.
Let's wait until 20 years from now, and then look back at today's post.

As for the turbofan engine, let's be patient, there will be results soon.

Please share your details about JF-17 it won't hurt me at least

USA is not sitting idle either in military jet engine development fields they are at least 2 step ahead of you

I have lots of examples for you from the past/present and future

 

[YourDaddy]

I'm denying that Chinese arms are unreliable we proved JF-17 against weapons systems of EU/Israel/Russian and USA of India but in few fields like military jet engine development fields China still 15 to 20 years behind the west especially to the USA

Not 15-20 years ws-15 already in service maybe 5 years behind.

 

[YourDaddy]

Please share your details about JF-17 it won't hurt me at least

USA is not sitting idle either in military jet engine development fields they are at least 2 step ahead of you

I have lots of examples for you from the past/present and future

Usa is not sitting idle but Chinese pace in turbofan engines already eclipsed that of Russia. Like one member of the forum said al51 is still just a prototype and it has thrust ratio as that of ws-15 lol. From ws-10 to ws-10c then ws-15 all in a span of a couple. years.china is also working on ws-19 for j-31/j-35. China graduates 4.7 million stem students annually. Eventually everything will fall into place.

 

[Irfan Usmani 1977]

Usa is not sitting idle but Chinese pace in turbofan engines already eclipsed that of Russia. Like one member of the forum said al51 is still just a prototype and it has thrust ratio as that of ws-15 lol. From ws-10 to ws-10c then ws-15 all in a span of a couple years.china is also working on ws-19 for j-31/j-35.

Not couple of years but years to develop first turbofan project namely WS10 was started in late 80s and completed in 2013 ( certified for production) WS15 project started in late 90s/early 2000 and still in trial and testing phase on J20

 

[YourDaddy]

China’s new ‘shark-skin’-tech fighter engines threaten US air power

Chinese researchers create 3D-printed turbofan engine structures inspired by shark skin, boosting aerodynamic efficiency with reduced drag.

interestingengineering.com

China's Next-Gen Fighter Jet Engine Could Surpass US As Scientists Claim Another "Groundbreaking Innovation"

China has claimed groundbreaking innovation poised to revolutionize aviation technology: a shark skin-inspired structure embedded within a turbofan engine. According to Chinese claims, this development promises to significantly reduce drag and enhance engine efficiency, potentially propelling...

www.eurasiantimes.com