Chinese Naval Platform & PLAN discussions

[onlinpunit]

No, not like you Indians in the 1962 war were the canon folders of US and UK. The US army were at the Chinese border in 1950.

Ok

 

[Foinikas]

How you guys justify and cope with the millions of death due to famines sponsored by the glorious leader. !

Ssshhh don't mention that. They don't like it

Anyway,it seems that the 052D are to be the Arleigh Burke's direct opponents. Such a massive ship and such a big number of models to be built,are obviously an attempt to rival the AB of the USN. It's a good attempt.

 

[MH.Yang]

Now that's a excellent coping mechanism !!
How you guys justify and cope with the millions of death due to famines sponsored by the glorious leader. !

First of all, it was not millions of people who died of starvation, and it was about 12 million people who died of starvation. Although we don't have a way to count the exact number of deaths, China conducts population counts every year. Comparing 1958/1960 with other years, population growth slowed by about 12 million. Incidentally, by this method it is also possible to calculate that about 5 million people died in India during COVID19 because of the epidemic.


Secondly, the error of these three years is a history known to every Chinese and an undeniable fact. A mistake is a mistake and there is no point in denying it, but rather, lessons should be learned to avoid making the same mistake next time. Mao Zedong was our great leader, but he was equally human and made mistakes. His merits will be remembered and his faults will not be forgotten.

Thirdly, the famine was caused by the "Great Leap Forward" movement. Almost all of China's industrial base and basic agricultural facilities were built in the three years 1958/1960. For example, CAC, which built the J10 and J20, SAC, which built the J16, and CSR, which built the high-speed railroad, etc., all of their predecessors were founded in these three years. More than 90% of China's dams, canals and other agricultural facilities were also built in 1958/1960. Get the picture? The Chinese did over 30 years worth of work in that three year period and then had a famine which led to massive deaths of the people. Mao's radical development policies need to be held primarily responsible for this.

Fourth, do you know about the famine that happened in India during World War II? Tens of millions of people starved to death. Unlike China, Indians were deliberately starved to death by the British. Food from India was looted and transported to the European theater. Churchill even said that Indians breed like rabbits and don't need food.

 

[MH.Yang]

Ssshhh don't mention that. They don't like it

Anyway,it seems that the 052D are to be the Arleigh Burke's direct opponents. Such a massive ship and such a big number of models to be built,are obviously an attempt to rival the AB of the USN. It's a good attempt.

The Great Famine of 1958/1960 in China is objective and true history, and there is nothing that cannot be discussed. This part of history is the focus of Chinese history textbooks, and Chinese seventh-grade students as young as 13 years old begin to study this part of history. There is a Chinese saying that "blocking the mouths of the people is as dangerous as blocking a flood (防民之口甚于防川)". Only the government can publish a large amount of historical data, correctly analyze and summarize the lessons of history, and frankly admit its mistakes. This is the best way to eliminate rumors.

 

[Foinikas]

The Great Famine of 1958/1960 in China is objective and true history, and there is nothing that cannot be discussed. This part of history is the focus of Chinese history textbooks, and Chinese seventh-grade students as young as 13 years old begin to study this part of history. There is a Chinese saying that "blocking the mouths of the people is as dangerous as blocking a flood (防民之口甚于防川)". Only the government can publish a large amount of historical data, correctly analyze and summarize the lessons of history, and frankly admit its mistakes. This is the best way to eliminate rumors.

But does it explain how it was Mao's fault because of the stupid and disastrous policies of the CCP?

 

[MH.Yang]

But does it explain how it was Mao's fault because of the stupid and disastrous policies of the CCP?

I am a member of the Communist Party. From the point of view of communist philosophy, I will adhere to two principles in looking at issues: first, seeking truth from facts. Honestly looking at a problem is the best way to solve it. Two, dichotomy. Everything has its good side and its bad side.

1958/1960 was undoubtedly a mistake made by Mao Zedong. On the bad side, it cost China more than 10 million lives. On the good side, China achieved the initial modernization of the country; we had basic industry and basic modern agriculture. This eventually led to our victory over India leading industrialization. As I have already said, the planet has only enough resources to industrialize one of China and India.

Thirdly, please note that I have always said "mistake" and not "crime". Because, when the CCP under Mao Zedong made this decision, his subjective intention was to build the country better, not to satisfy his own selfish desires. It was a mistake for him to unintentionally make a wrong decision in leading the country. He intentionally damaged the country's interests for his selfish desires, and that is the crime. The former is excusable, the latter is not.

As for whether or not CCP is stupid, people on this forum have their own answers, and I don't need to explain them. If CCP is stupid, then what about those who were defeated by CCP?

During Modi's rule, 5 million people died in India because of COVID19. So what do you think Indians should do about this mistake?

 

[Foinikas]

Thirdly, please note that I have always said "mistake" and not "crime".

And that's the problem. Millions dying by Mao and the CCP's policies are a "mistake" and not a "crime".

I am a member of the Communist Party.

I see.

 

[MH.Yang]

And that's the problem. Millions dying by Mao and the CCP's policies are a "mistake" and not a "crime".


I see.

So what do you want? You think we're going to destroy an efficient and rational ruling party over a 70 year old mistake?

Why wouldn't Americans go against Trump when the Republican presidency of Hoover led to the Great Depression and the deaths of tons of Americans?

 

[FuturePAF]

前面已经说了，我们不同的舰艇负责不同的功能，我们有更强大的055，可以说是世界最强，052D只是我们的主心骨，所以它的功能已经开发到极限了，可以说十艘052D加上五艘054B，基本上可以灭掉全世界90%的海军！

Longer VLS tubes can enable the PLAN to “share” the Type 055’s radar and fire more capable missiles, similar to the US’s CEC: Cooperative Engagement Capability.

https://www.dote.osd.mil/Portals/97/pub/reports/FY2013/navy/2013cec.pdf

CEC is a real-time sensor netting system that enables high-quality situational awareness and Integrated Fire Control capability. There are four major U.S. Navy variants of CEC: - The USG-2A is used in selected Aegis cruisers and destroyers, LPD-17/LHD amphibious ships, and CVN-68 class aircraft carriers.

 

[Foinikas]

So what do you want? You think we're going to destroy an efficient and rational ruling party over a 70 year old mistake?

No,because you can't. It rules you. It hasn't allowed any other party come to power.

 

[MH.Yang]

No,because you can't. It rules you. It hasn't allowed any other party come to power.

CCP is our choice. Because you are afraid of it.

By the way, China is a country with universal suffrage and there are still 8 opposition parties in China. Only the CCP has 90 million party members, 80 million members of the Communist Youth League, and 120 million Young Pioneers, that makes the election meaningless.

Also, you're using your subjective judgment to define us, and you don't even understand China at all. This is very stupid and rude. If you want to use this tactic to indoctrinate me with your ideas, I suggest you stop it immediately. I am an adult, I have my own values and outlook on life, and you cannot influence me with such childish comments.

 

[MH.Yang]

And that's the problem. Millions dying by Mao and the CCP's policies are a "mistake" and not a "crime".


I see.

Yes, I am a communist.

While I realize you are an anti-communist, I respect your freedom of speech. Even if I don't agree with you, I listen carefully to what you have to say.

 

[zhanlong]

CCP is our choice. Because you are afraid of it.

By the way, China is a country with universal suffrage and there are still 8 opposition parties in China. Only the CCP has 90 million party members, 80 million members of the Communist Youth League, and 120 million Young Pioneers, that makes the election meaningless.

Also, you're using your subjective judgment to define us, and you don't even understand China at all. This is very stupid and rude. If you want to use this tactic to indoctrinate me with your ideas, I suggest you stop it immediately. I am an adult, I have my own values and outlook on life, and you cannot influence me with such childish comments.

no, bro. CCP is not our choice. Never.

 

[MH.Yang]

no, bro. CCP is not our choice. Never.

It's your freedom not to choose CCP. Choose CCP, that's my freedom.

While I don't agree with your choice, I will defend your right to make it.

Likewise, I expect you to respect the right of others to choose.

 

[Foinikas]

CCP is our choice. Because you are afraid of it.

It's not your choice,because you haven't had one ever since CCP won the civil war.