Gaza-Israel Conflict | 2023-2024

[newb3e]

No body with clear mind and just heart denies Israeli is working under Satan lead, but they have much greater power to Hamas. The way Hamas do their strategy will lead to destruction of Palestinians and we all have seen it for decades and currently we see the the greatest destruction happening in Gaza

even if hammas dont attack these jewish bastards the jews will murder Palestinians its sick to see people calling hammas tactics bad when alll they see if life under open prison cut from basics of life! i wish they had bigger weapons a good AD system so they could shoot down these manic jewwish bastards war planes!

 

[Falcon29]

Unlike the Greek guy engaged with above, @Indos means well for the Palestinians, except Indos is too thick headed to understand the situation despite almost 4000 PAGES of discussion on this topic, counting from the old PDF!!
Sigh!!

I know Indos from the old pdf and he knows me. We would conversate in Arabic coffee shop a lot. I respect his opinion even though I disagree with it.

 

[Davey Crockett]

So what’s your strategy?

I am Palestinian, we have tried the peaceful route. Oslo was signed, weapons were given up yet what has happened to the West Bank?

More occupation, oppression, illegal settlements, killings with impunity, etc

Palestinians in West Bank are corner in little enclaves, you don’t see a problem with that?

You can’t expect Palestinians not to resist when this is happening.

Why is there no change in the conditions of West Bank? Hamas does not control it. Why does Israel still murder people daily and imprison them?

We have to remove the financing for Israel from America and European countries, who's money and arms is used to support the bandit state.

Israel cannot be trusted, at all. The bandit state has to go. There is a reason Jews have been expelled over 100 times throughout history. Palestine will be the next state to expell the Zionists.

America will be next.

Cannot remember the book title, written just over 100 years ago, where an American Jew warned his fellow travellers if they do not straighten up, America will have to expell them by the end of the 20th century.

It's coming.

 

[Sanwal]

This forum is well moderated - use the report button and it will be dealt with.
We are also not an echo chamber and will allow freedom of expression as long as it doesn’t break forum rules.

With all due respect, Mod, perhaps the forum administrators should review their 'freedom of expression' rules. For comparison, try to express your support for the Palestinian cause to any of the 'Western administered' forums and let me know how tolerant they are. Anyway, I am going to further escalate. I have made my point, and I will not be surprised if the fate of this forum will be similar to the old forum.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Thick heads don't understand that Israelis just don't want to 'occupy': They also want to 'displace' the Palestinians. The British were colonizers in the Indo-Pak Subcontinent but they exploited resources--they didn't want to or couldn't displace the locals. That's just one example but IMO most colonial powers, over the last few centuries at least have been like that: Exploitation of resources. But Israel is different because it actually wants to displace the locals and has been able to do so if you look into the large Palestinian diaspora outside of the historic Palestine.
So, even 'colonization' is a mild term to describe what Israel has done, is doing, and wants to do!!

The british during the time of the raj DID want to replace the locals but the goreh soon found out that they could not outbreak us. Make no mistake about it, the israelis are doing to the Palestinians what the british did to us during the time of the raj. In fact, the israelis learnt this from the british empire as they are responsible for the creation of israel via the balfour declaration.

 

[Indos]

Be patient while my people are being slaughtered and ethnically cleansed off their land?

Be patient when Palestinians get no justice when they are murdered?

Let’s be real

Hamas speed up the process of Palestinian destruction. What Hamas do dont have any positive impact to Palestinian. Hamas is like Al Qaeda who think they help Islam with what they are doing but we know AQ is the reason the Islamophobia is accelerated across the world. It is ideology that you beleive and then it becomes part of you and become your ego. Despite we have seen so clearly what the impact of it, people like you would still support Hamas.

The same like Shiah who support Bashar that destroy Syria and killed many Muslim in process just because to back their own group (ego) instead of forcing Bsshar to resign to avoid civil war

The same like Shiah who support Hamas because they dont want people think the resistence movement created by their beloved Iran is just useless and bring no benefit except destruction to Gaza people.

Israel is Satanic power, we all know that. No dispute on that. All have understood they dont care with civilians, it has been more than a decade the world understand that. And of course we know they have religious backing to destroy their enemies with no mercy like the story of Amalek.

This Satanic power is no match to Hamas, there should be different approach to deal with it.

And the victims of your Big Ego is Palestinian women, kids, and babies that look like you dont really care

 

[Falcon29]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1799876377723777264

 

[Foinikas]

Hamas cares more for Palestinians than Fatah ever has!

Let's agree to disagree on that,respectfully.

Stop complaining, you enjoy here preferential treatment and great hospitality, if you have any decency and open mind you should be silent and observing to learn something what real palestinians like Falcon29 have to say

A real palestinian from USA?

I've had Palestinian friends who were actually from Palestine. West Bank. I've known Lebanese,I've known Syrians,I've known Palestinians,irl and online. None are particularly fond of Hamas. Falcon29 isn't exactly an "expert" or "objective" on the matter.

and not entering in discussion with him attacking his position by zionist infested wikipedia "information".

Oh wait a minute. So when wikipedia talks about Bosnian war crimes of "evil Serbs",it's all valid and true,but when it comes to the Arab-Israeli Wars and Palestinian issue,it's "zionist infested"? Talk about double standards...

remember you are on a Pakistani defense forum you hypocritical Israeli Nazi supporting scumbag.

Khansaheeb,I can't really understand you man. One day you agree with me,the other day you insult me. One day you like my posts,the other day you are angry at me. Why do you call me "hypocritical Israeli Nazi supporting scumbag"? Because I am not a Hamas apologist? Because I don't see Hamas as the benevolent freedom fighters you guys think they are?

There would be NO HAMAS without Israeli occupation and oppression of the Palestinian people. You want to get rid of Hamas? Start by giving Palestinians their freedom, justice ,and human rights from this terrorist entity called Israel.

@Musings here's where you can explain it to him

You are just like them whitewashing Israeli crimes by solely pinning it on Hamas who only exist because of the crimes of this terrorist entity.

So when Hamas hits a school bus,that's not terror but resistance? When they attack a cafe,we should only talk about Israeli crimes? It is haram to talk about the other side's crimes too?

Foinikas has valid argument. He is not like Antonius stone head. Foinikas care with Palestinian women, kids, babies more than Hamas lover in here

Man,I've known Palestinians for years. Those specific people who have been insulting him here,are hotheaded and won't accept a different opinion. I used to have Palestinian female friends from the West Bank.My Arabics teacher was Palestinian,one of my eye doctors was Libyan,when I went to study,at the uni there I got to know a good Lebanese guy for a bit,a few Syrians and a couple of Palestinians.One of the Syrians ended up being a good friend. When the war in Syria started in the 2010s I got to know a lot of Syrian and Lebanese people(mostly women)and some Arab guys as well from here and there.

In the early 2000s I bought "Death in Gaza" the documentary about a journalist who was shot by the IDF while filming his own doc in Gaza. I bought "Divine Intervention",the movie. I bought books about the Arab-Israeli conflicts and the Palestinian issue. I used to wear a kuffiyeh often. I listened to Arabic pop almost every day. I had debates with communists,disagreeing when they kept saying "we believe it's the big capital in Israel" and I used to say "no,I think it's Zionists in Israel who do that" and they would go like "no,no it's the big capital and the Americans". I used to record documentaries about Palestine and Iraq when they were on TV. The internet wasn't full of documentaries back then and Youtube almost non-existant.

And all that,to have a few brats who live in the other side of the world call me all kinds of names,because what I say doesn't fit their narrative and their minds cannot possibly comprehend that someone can disagree with them AND not support Israeli genocide.

It’s posts like this that agitate the masses. Israel have been stealing land and setting up illegal settlements - documented evidence of rape - collecting punishment - genocide and an apartheid state but you continue sweeping this under the carpet. Hamas Hamas Hamas is all you keep saying. 40,000 deaths mostly of jnnocent children and women and you want us to ignore and condone Hamas?
Get real

That has been going on for years. When did I ignore that? What you guys have been doing instead,is being Hamas apologists. You say posts like these agitate the masses. Should I only appeal to the masses then when they consider that a wrong rights another wrong? They call out Israelis for their dishonorable acts,while they cheer for Hamas and their dishonorable acts.

 

[Falcon29]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1799438426237981047

 

[Musings]

Let's agree to disagree on that,respectfully.

A real palestinian from USA?

I've had Palestinian friends who were actually from Palestine. West Bank. I've known Lebanese,I've known Syrians,I've known Palestinians,irl and online. None are particularly fond of Hamas. Falcon29 isn't exactly an "expert" or "objective" on the matter.


Oh wait a minute. So when wikipedia talks about Bosnian war crimes of "evil Serbs",it's all valid and true,but when it comes to the Arab-Israeli Wars and Palestinian issue,it's "zionist infested"? Talk about double standards...


Khansaheeb,I can't really understand you man. One day you agree with me,the other day you insult me. One day you like my posts,the other day you are angry at me. Why do you call me "hypocritical Israeli Nazi supporting scumbag"? Because I am not a Hamas apologist? Because I don't see Hamas as the benevolent freedom fighters you guys think they are?



@Musings here's where you can explain it to him


So when Hamas hits a school bus,that's not terror but resistance? When they attack a cafe,we should only talk about Israeli crimes? It is haram to talk about the other side's crimes too?



Man,I've known Palestinians for years. Those specific people who have been insulting him here,are hotheaded and won't accept a different opinion. I used to have Palestinian female friends from the West Bank.My Arabics teacher was Palestinian,one of my eye doctors was Libyan,when I went to study,at the uni there I got to know a good Lebanese guy for a bit,a few Syrians and a couple of Palestinians.One of the Syrians ended up being a good friend. When the war in Syria started in the 2010s I got to know a lot of Syrian and Lebanese people(mostly women)and some Arab guys as well from here and there.

In the early 2000s I bought "Death in Gaza" the documentary about a journalist who was shot by the IDF while filming his own doc in Gaza. I bought "Divine Intervention",the movie. I bought books about the Arab-Israeli conflicts and the Palestinian issue. I used to wear a kuffiyeh often. I listened to Arabic pop almost every day. I had debates with communists,disagreeing when they kept saying "we believe it's the big capital in Israel" and I used to say "no,I think it's Zionists in Israel who do that" and they would go like "no,no it's the big capital and the Americans". I used to record documentaries about Palestine and Iraq when they were on TV. The internet wasn't full of documentaries back then and Youtube almost non-existant.

And all that,to have a few brats who live in the other side of the world call me all kinds of names,because what I say doesn't fit their narrative and their minds cannot possibly comprehend that someone can disagree with them AND not support Israeli genocide.


That has been going on for years. When did I ignore that? What you guys have been doing instead,is being Hamas apologists. You say posts like these agitate the masses. Should I only appeal to the masses then when they consider that a wrong rights another wrong? They call out Israelis for their dishonorable acts,while they cheer for Hamas and their dishonorable acts.

No - the love and desire you have for the Israeli cause is noted. You don’t give a shit about innocent Palestinians slaughtered. You won’t look at the conflict objectively and blame Hamas for everything.
40,000 death of innocent - yet you want to ignore the slaughter and snipers shooting people in hospitals and killing people waiting for hand outs at food banks. It’s shines a light on your intent

 

[UKBengali]

Dude, be patience. How long have you been under Israeli occupation ? Do you think you are the sole nation who ever experience colonization ?

Be realistic, pragmatic.

Can you not see the simple difference of being a colony where the colonial population is not settling your land and so killing and expelling the natives to make a country out of your own country?

Yes all our countries were colonised but we were not expelled from our villages, towns and cities to make way for mass settlements from the coloniser. The coloniser just wanted some loot.

There was always the comfort that one day the coloniser would leave and we would have our country back.

This is a unique situation and much worse than Apartheid S Africa. As the world turned against that regime and so we will soon see the same for this blot on humanity.

The Zionist plan is to kill and expel every Palestinian and leave a token 10-15% minority in Palestine to show they are a "democracy".

Palestinianis have every right to resist as they see fit and we as Muslims must provide at least our moral support if we cannot or are not prepared to support them militarily.

 

[Khansaheeb]

Let's agree to disagree on that,respectfully.

A real palestinian from USA?

I've had Palestinian friends who were actually from Palestine. West Bank. I've known Lebanese,I've known Syrians,I've known Palestinians,irl and online. None are particularly fond of Hamas. Falcon29 isn't exactly an "expert" or "objective" on the matter.


Oh wait a minute. So when wikipedia talks about Bosnian war crimes of "evil Serbs",it's all valid and true,but when it comes to the Arab-Israeli Wars and Palestinian issue,it's "zionist infested"? Talk about double standards...


Khansaheeb,I can't really understand you man. One day you agree with me,the other day you insult me. One day you like my posts,the other day you are angry at me. Why do you call me "hypocritical Israeli Nazi supporting scumbag"? Because I am not a Hamas apologist? Because I don't see Hamas as the benevolent freedom fighters you guys think they are?



@Musings here's where you can explain it to him


So when Hamas hits a school bus,that's not terror but resistance? When they attack a cafe,we should only talk about Israeli crimes? It is haram to talk about the other side's crimes too?



Man,I've known Palestinians for years. Those specific people who have been insulting him here,are hotheaded and won't accept a different opinion. I used to have Palestinian female friends from the West Bank.My Arabics teacher was Palestinian,one of my eye doctors was Libyan,when I went to study,at the uni there I got to know a good Lebanese guy for a bit,a few Syrians and a couple of Palestinians.One of the Syrians ended up being a good friend. When the war in Syria started in the 2010s I got to know a lot of Syrian and Lebanese people(mostly women)and some Arab guys as well from here and there.

In the early 2000s I bought "Death in Gaza" the documentary about a journalist who was shot by the IDF while filming his own doc in Gaza. I bought "Divine Intervention",the movie. I bought books about the Arab-Israeli conflicts and the Palestinian issue. I used to wear a kuffiyeh often. I listened to Arabic pop almost every day. I had debates with communists,disagreeing when they kept saying "we believe it's the big capital in Israel" and I used to say "no,I think it's Zionists in Israel who do that" and they would go like "no,no it's the big capital and the Americans". I used to record documentaries about Palestine and Iraq when they were on TV. The internet wasn't full of documentaries back then and Youtube almost non-existant.

And all that,to have a few brats who live in the other side of the world call me all kinds of names,because what I say doesn't fit their narrative and their minds cannot possibly comprehend that someone can disagree with them AND not support Israeli genocide.


That has been going on for years. When did I ignore that? What you guys have been doing instead,is being Hamas apologists. You say posts like these agitate the masses. Should I only appeal to the masses then when they consider that a wrong rights another wrong? They call out Israelis for their dishonorable acts,while they cheer for Hamas and their dishonorable acts.

My apologies my dear friend. Just be careful you don't stand on the wrong side of history. Remember Greece is on the border and a frontline state with Islamic world and after Israel you don't want Greece to face the wrath of Muslims. Believe me it wouldn't take much to defeat the Greeks as we showed during the WW2. I have had a few Greek friends and have nothing against Greek people, I hope to visit Greece one day but for some inexplicable reasonable keeping missing it off the list! Palestine is a particularly sensitive topic for Pakistanis because we too like the Palestinians faced potential genocide in 1947, so we will overreact and side with the Palestinians.

 

[Meengla]

Gaentz resignation is very bad timing for Israel and especially for Netanyahu. Maybe there was some truth in someone said above that Netanyahu tried to stop the resignation by throwing in everything to get the four hostages out yesterday. Perhaps there is a CIA inspired coup going on in Israel. There is speculation about Netanyahu's speech to the US Congress delayed till July 24--he may not last that long!!

'This is exactly what Sinwar, Nasrallah, and Iran were aiming for': MKs react to Gantz's gov. exit

Opposition leaders, including Yair Lapid and Avigdor Liberman, welcomed the decision, while Labor leader Yair Golan criticized the timing, calling it too late of a decision.

www.jpost.com

 

[Khansaheeb]

And you're proud of the way Hamas handled it? Or are you saying Hamas cares for Palestinians in the West Bank?
Look,you have to understand,Hamas wants one thing: Popularity and to rule Palestine themselves. No sharing of power. They want a Palestine under their control. They keep attacking the yahood because they want to stay relevant. They tremble that some other group might pop up and take their popularity or maybe Fatah and others on the secular side will find a deal with the Israelis. Then what will happen to them? No money,no cashflow from Qatar,from Iran,from other countries,no Hamastan. Remember what they did to Fatah in 2007-2008?

If you are truly Greek you would know that resistance is just, imagine if Nazi Germany had occupied Greece long term, do you condemn the Greek resistance that rose up against Nazi Germany like the Palestinians have risen up against Nazi Israel? :-

The Greek resistance (Greek: Εθνική Αντίσταση, romanized: Ethnikí Antístasi "National Resistance") involved armed and unarmed groups from across the political spectrum that resisted the Axis occupation of Greece in the period 1941–1944, during World War II. The largest group was the Communist-dominated EAM-ELAS. The Greek Resistance is considered one of the strongest resistance movements in Nazi-occupied Europe,[9] with partisans, men and women known as andartes and andartisses (Greek: αντάρτες, αντάρτισσες, romanized: antártes, antártises, meaning "male and female rebels"),[9][10][11] controlling much of the countryside prior to the German withdrawal from Greece in late 1944.

Greek resistance - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Greeks like the Palestinians also suffered at the hands of the occupying power:-

When the Nazis Massacred Greek Civilians to Send a Warning to Those Who Resisted

Eighty years ago, German soldiers killed an estimated 500 Cretans in Viannos and Ierapetra in retaliation for an attack by local partisans

www.smithsonianmag.com

Don't forget it was people like my Grandfather in British Indian army who ferociously fought and defeated the Nazis to help give you the freedom you enjoy today.

 

[Indos]

Can you not see the simple difference of being a colony where the colonial population is not settling your land and so killing and expelling the natives to make a country out of your own country?

Yes all our countries were colonised but we were not expelled from our villages, towns and cities to make way for mass settlements from the coloniser. The coloniser just wanted some loot.

There was always the comfort that one day the coloniser would leave and we would have our country back.

This is a unique situation and much worse than Apartheid S Africa. As the world turned against that regime and so we will soon see the same for this blot on humanity.

The Zionist plan is to kill and expel every Palestinian and leave a token 10-15% minority in Palestine to show they are a "democracy".

Palestinianis have every right to resist as they see fit and we as Muslims must provide at least our moral support if we cannot or are not prepared to support them militarily.

If we use strategic calculation. What made many Muslim majority countries get liberated after 1945 ? Yup it is the change in Geopolitics that is the result of WW2. Many Western power get weakend. What happened with the rebellion before that ? They are crushed and it is despite the Muslim fighters have noble cause

So any thing will come with common sense.

I dont want to explain too detail. So in essence the arm struggle movement of Palestinian is not supported yet with supportive geopolitics and global power balance. It will fail unless the global power balance changes