Gaza-Israel Conflict | 2023-2024

Unknowntruth said:
I see what you are doing, you are just here to cause infighting. Why are you masquerading as being Turkish? Reveal your true identity.

My great grandpa died fighting for the Ottoman Empire, he was sent to Yemen. So you are going to paint all Arabs with a broad brush? Far more Arabs fought with the Ottoman Empire than against.

Why did the Ottoman Empire fall? Traitors surely added to it. Ottomans have to blame themselves also.

1. Choosing the wrong side and making a secret pact with Germany.
2. Failure to modernize, it failed to modernize its industrial complex. It lacked the industrial might to produce heavy weapons weapons, iron, munitions, etc. It was still heavy reliant on farming while other countries for like over 100 years already had an Industrial Revolution.
3. Failure to educate the population, extremely low literacy rates. Huge failure on that part.

There were many failures of the Ottoman Empire. It severely lacked foresight and have no one to blame but their selves. Traitor Arabs did contribute too but not like the Ottoman Empire needed any more help to destroy itself.
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In some other thread, your post should be pinned!! Absolutely correct. And I so sick of Turks and Pakistanis and whoever who bring this so-called Betrayal of the Ottomans by 'the Arabs'! I don't take sides between the two--both regions are friendly to Pakistan and long time allies. But the BS about the betrayal of the Ottomans is sickening!!
 
Musings said:
I see you fly the flags of Turkey

What is your opinion of your leader flying Palestinian flags and doing speeches to enhance the Palestinian cause - yet at the same time continue to allow the flow of oil into Israel?
Why show the love yet fuel those creating genocide and war crimes?
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We can include Pakistan in that long list of inaction by Muslim countries.
 
LegionnairE said:
I said it a million times. If they wanted Turkish protection. They shouldn't have betrayed the Ottoman Empire.

After that, there's nothing we can do.

They wanted independence.
This is independence.

They trusted the British,
This is what it gets you.

Better luck cutting open Turkish soldiers' stomachs looking for gold next time you piece of sh.ts
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The ottomans betrayed the Muslims when their empire became a liberal westernised land of bid'ah. But this is history and off topic I suppose. Turkey can do something about it NOW but is flip flopping like a munafiq.
 
Unknowntruth said:
I see what you are doing, you are just here to cause infighting. Why are you masquerading as being Turkish? Reveal your true identity.

My great grandpa died fighting for the Ottoman Empire, he was sent to Yemen. So you are going to paint all Arabs with a broad brush? Far more Arabs fought with the Ottoman Empire than against.

Why did the Ottoman Empire fall? Traitors surely added to it. Ottomans have to blame themselves also.

1. Choosing the wrong side and making a secret pact with Germany.
2. Failure to modernize, it failed to modernize its industrial complex. It lacked the industrial might to produce heavy weapons weapons, iron, munitions, etc. It was still heavy reliant on farming while other countries for like over 100 years already had an Industrial Revolution.
3. Failure to educate the population, extremely low literacy rates. Huge failure on that part.

There were many failures of the Ottoman Empire. It severely lacked foresight and have no one to blame but their selves. Traitor Arabs did contribute too but not like the Ottoman Empire needed any more help to destroy itself.
Click to expand...

This user is a Kemalist pro-westerner. He doesn't like Islam or Ottomans, he's playing devil advocate. He is happy with the West and Israel.
 
Meengla said:
In some other thread, your post should be pinned!! Absolutely correct. And I so sick of Turks and Pakistanis and whoever who bring this so-called Betrayal of the Ottomans by 'the Arabs'! I don't take sides between the two--both regions are friendly to Pakistan and long time allies. But the BS about the betrayal of the Ottomans is sickening!!
Click to expand...
Yes, they act like Ottoman Empire did not have their own faults. Truth is, they were already crumbling long before their stupid decision to join a war with Germany. It was years of failure and bad decision making that led up to that. Sharif Hussein the traitor led the revolt. Right now they are still showing themselves as traitors. Still, many fought for the Ottoman Empire especially Palestinians and Syrians. My great grandpa did not die fighting for the Ottoman Empire in order to be slandered.
 
Unknowntruth said:
Yes, they act like Ottoman Empire did not have their own faults. Truth is, they were already crumbling long before their stupid decision to join a war with Germany. It was years of failure and bad decision making that led up to that. Sharif Hussein the traitor led the revolt. Right now they are still showing themselves as traitors. Still, many fought for the Ottoman Empire especially Palestinians and Syrians. My great grandpa did not die fighting for the Ottoman Empire in order to be slandered.
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This is off topic. But I am aware of the history of the 'The Sick Man of Europe'.
While I respect the modern Turkey not supporting the Palestinians enough due to Turkey's trade/commercial interests--especially when the GCC Arabs are not doing enough--hiding behind a century old bogus claim of the 'Arab betrayal of the Ottoman' is a disingenuous argument to hide the true reasons the modern Turkey is not helping the Palestinians enough.

I think you have already brilliantly clarified what happened around World War One. I will butt out of this debate--I generally don't engage in historic debates anyway. But when some BS keeps coming into this thread then it is hard to stay silent.
 
Meengla said:
This is off topic. But I am aware of the history of the 'The Sick Man of Europe'.
While I respect the modern Turkey not supporting the Palestinians enough due to Turkey's trade/commercial interests--especially when the GCC Arabs are not doing enough--hiding behind a century old bogus claim of the 'Arab betrayal of the Ottoman' is a disingenuous argument to hide the true reasons the modern Turkey is not helping the Palestinians enough.

I think you have already brilliantly clarified what happened around World War One. I will butt out of this debate--I generally don't engage in historic debates anyway. But when some BS keeps coming into this thread then it is hard to stay silent.
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I agree with you 100 percent. Don’t hide behind history for your inaction. Turkey now is just playing both sides. This is what a lot of Arab countries were doing before, playing to the masses to garner support. A lot of big talk Turkey is speaking yet is more than happy to trade and supply Israel with its oil needs. I didn’t want to reply to him, he just pissed me off gloating at the death of Palestinians.
 
The operations carried out by the Palestinian resistance groups in Gaza on Tuesday, January 16, are as follows:

Qassam Brigades:

  • Bombarded the occupied city of Netivot with a massive barrage of rockets.
  • Targeted an Israeli troop carrier with a ‘Shuath’ device and an ‘Al-Yassin 105’ shell, north of Sheikh Radwan neighborhood in Gaza City.
  • Targeted an Israeli military vehicle with a ‘Yassin 105’ shell and engaged in clashes with an infantry force using machine guns and grenades west of Tal al-Hawa in Gaza City, causing Israeli casualties.
  • Pounded a gathering of Israeli military vehicles and soldiers in Khan Yunis, south of the Gaza Strip, with mortar shells.
  • Seized an Israeli military drone that was on a spying mission in the border region.
  • Targeted two Israeli military tanks with ‘Al-Yassin 105’ shells and a military bulldozer with two anti-armor devices, and engaged in clashes an infantry, south of Khan Yunis city.
  • Targeted concentrations of Israeli military penetrating north of the Nuseirat camp in the central Gaza Strip with heavy-caliber mortar shells.
  • Targeted an Israeli troop carrier on Jabal Al-Rais, east of the Al-Tuffah neighborhood in Gaza City, and engaged in clashes with soldiers near it, causing deaths and injuries.
  • Targeted concentrations of Israeli soldiers east of the Al-Tuffah neighborhood in Gaza City with mortar shells.
 
There is defeatism in this article on a major Israeli website--and even the usual bravado in the Comments section is a little less. The mightiest military power in the Middle East is facing some problems against an imprisoned militia.
Tsk. Tsk. Tsk!


...

Changed goals​

The Biden administration — without whose military supplies Israel quite simply could not continue to fight, and whose representatives regularly participate in Israeli war cabinet discussions — is watching all this play out with mounting dismay.
...
On his most recent visit, US Secretary of State Antony Blinken, openly worried about potential escalation on other fronts, eschewed talk of destroying or dismantling Hamas and instead repeatedly backed what he apparently unilaterally decided is now the Israeli goal of “ensuring that October 7 can never happen again.”
...
If that is the formulation now guiding Washington — rather than the “legitimate objective” to “eliminate Hamas” that the president hitherto championed — then the US, watching Israel’s government failing to responsibly direct an immensely difficult military campaign — seems certain to keep increasing the pressure for the fighting to wind down.

...
What it needs is clear-cut political direction. Otherwise, Israel faces the danger of Hamas’s leadership and fighting force surviving, partially intact, of our other enemies delighted, and of Israelis in the south, the north, and everywhere in between, remaining bereft of security. And that is both unconscionable and untenable.
---
And a Comment:
"The root of the problem is the US Democrat Party, it’s media outlets and the Biden administration’s wishy-washy stance, and, for that matter, the US failure, dating to 9/11, to itself adopt and to support allied adoption of WWII rules of engagement pursuant to formal declarations of war in response to major Islamist terrorist attacks.



Weakness invites aggression; appeasement of enemies bent on conquest makes war inevitable—on the aggressor’s terms. To a large extent, Israel is being forced to fight on the enemy’s terms.



Hamas believes time is on its side; and Hezbollah and its evil sponsor, Iran, are watching and taking notes as the forces of appeasement pressure Israel to fight with one arm tied behind its back."
 
Meengla said:
In some other thread, your post should be pinned!! Absolutely correct. And I so sick of Turks and Pakistanis and whoever who bring this so-called Betrayal of the Ottomans by 'the Arabs'! I don't take sides between the two--both regions are friendly to Pakistan and long time allies. But the BS about the betrayal of the Ottomans is sickening!!
Click to expand...



And if this was true, so what?

That would be more than 100 years ago anyway and no-one who betrayed the Ottomans is any longer alive. The sins of ancestors cannot be passed on through the generations.

Erdogan is an ultimate hypocrite and his crocodile tears for Gazans have been exposed as a sham.

He along with his Azeri buddies are providing oil to the Zionist criminals to commit genocide on the Gazans.
 
UKBengali said:
And if this was true, so what?
That would be more than 100 years ago anyway and no-one who betrayed the Ottomans is any longer alive. The sins of ancestors cannot be passed on through the generations.
Erdogan is an ultimate hypocrite and his crocodile tears for Gazans have been exposed as a sham.
He along with his Azeri buddies are providing oil to the Zionist criminals to commit genocide on the Gazans.
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100 years or not, there was no 'betrayal' as some Turks and their apologists, including from the Pakistani members on PDF say. @Unknowntruth has given a very good summary.
Some Turks are lying behind the myth of the so-called Arab betrayal. It is actually a laughable myth! Oh, I don't want to go into that here. Enough off topic.

But, yes, Erdogan, to use Larry C. Johnson's words about him since this conflict began, turned out to be a 'bag of air'. It would have been wise for Erdogan to be more circumspect.
 
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