Iran - Israel/US War: Israel-US declare war on Iran, Iran responds

[Aggregate]

I believe the two-step framework has been proposed by Pakistan, Turkey, Saudi Arabia and another Muslim country that I can't remember.

The simple fact that a belligerent state (KSA) was involved in drafting it is reason enough for Iran to say no to it, but that's probably emotional. So, ignore it.

Nevertheless, it is against Iran's interests. No brownie points for Pakistan to offer such a one-sided ceasefire to Iran.

We are not asking for any Brownie points. There is no ban on presenting proposals .. and Its Iranian Govt's decision to accept it or reject it. That's all there is to it, to this pointless argument.

 

[Musings]

@Jugantor
Why you got 2 accounts? Dont try to be clever - it doesnt suit you - 1 more post from this account and i will ban your main account.

 

[ShapurII]

Then don't post things like "all self-inflicted" and feign ignorance.

What does Pakistan brokering talks have to do with your support for Iran?

You started off your rant by claiming Pakistan was going to back-stab Iran. What amazing revelation did you receive from the Almighty to convey this to us?

What has Pakistan done to Iran for you to run yet another propaganda against Pakistan?

You clearly have no facts...it's your bias against Pakistan which is clouding your judgement. I couldn't care less if you had this bias but kept it to yourself which is your prerogative, but by sharing here, your nonsense will be challenged.

The people of Pakistan, both Sunni and Shiite, are widely pro-Iran in this war and I don't doubt their sincerity in this. I don't think the same is true about the Pakistani system though. The situation is very complicated.

 

[omegalamba7xl9]

Now comes out the real angle. "Afghan champion" to rescue the Afghan cause.

You and the likes are known to most of us here. Keep up with your anti-Pakistani propaganda under the garb of your selective "ummah".

Where is your ummah when 3K Pakistanis are murdered by those Taliban bastards?

I don't see a single post of yours lamenting the loss of Pakistani Muslims but of course, there is the "ummah" when it suits your narrow purposes.

If there is ONE country in the Muslim world that has done as much as it possibly could for the Ummah with words and actions, it is Pakistan. So please don't lecture us about "ummah" this or that.

Iran can walk away, just the same as the US if they don't want Pakistan brokering. They haven't. Perhaps that tells you something that you don't know.

You do understand that any agreement has nothing to do with Trust on Pakistan, but rather direct trust between Iran/US ? Pakistan is passing messages between US and Iran, they are not controlling US & israel.

Many of us agree that US/israel cannot be trusted .. many of us also understand that despite Pakistan's efforts, the negotiations might not work at all ... but there is nothing involved here that justifies badmouthing Pakistan at all.

Iranian Govt and Military knows things better than you. And they are okay with Pakistan. There is no need for your 'certain' political opinion, that is pretty well known to everyone in Pakistan.

GOLD STAR .....ABSOLUTELY WELL PUT....

 

[Blain2]

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If there is one investment that Iran did ( by sacrifing investment into its airforce,) is surely Hezbollah.

They have been so underrated and have exceeded my expectations. They came out on the front foot hitting sixes right from the get go of the death of Khamenei.

When this war is over, Iran should continue supplying them when possible as they have proved to pay dividends and engage Israel in a two front war.

Lebanon is a territory which equalizes the two sides. Israelis have to put troops on the ground and Hizbollah's forces have been training for almost 3 decades for just such an eventuality.

I always knew that on the ground, the Israelis were going to get pushed around by small teams of Hizbollah fighters. I am impressed that not only are they using their ATGMs effectively, but they are also threatening Israelis in the air with their MANPADS.

They have used them far more effectively than the Iranians inside of Iran.

 

[Goenitz]

Any ceasefire will need a guarantor. Happy if Pakistan plays this role. If Israel breaches it we will have an excuse then....

Pak cannot guarantee. It must invite Russia, China and EU (some like France, not all). Pak must work for ending sanctions for Iran and develop the pipelines. Then work with the Chinese, supply cement, rebars, etc for reconstruction.

Pak must also persuade the West that we will help Iran to build an air force, so Iran will focus less on its missile force.

In fact, invite the US companies to develop Gawadar and in Iran (indirectly even)

 

[Yasser76]

Lovely post and exactly my sentiments. Id like to see them try……..inshallah as Trump would say

Without US they can do jack against us. Long range strikes would require tanker support over several nations and so even a F-35 hit would be seen coming.

Of course we can and will hit back.

This could possibly be the only way we can get Iran to agree.

 

[Yasser76]

Pak cannot guarantee. It must invite Russia, China and EU (some like France, not all). Pak must work for ending sanctions for Iran and develop the pipelines. Then work with the Chinese, supply cement, rebars, etc for reconstruction.

Pak must also persuade the West that we will help Iran to build an air force, so it will not focus less on its missile force.

Last line seems like a good idea

 

[Shags101]

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Russians are leaving how much you bet the Israelis and trump are go to try to take the fuel in case they think the Iranians would use the spent fuel for a plutonium bomb

 

[ShapurII]

Lebanon is a territory which equalizes the two sides. Israelis have to put troops on the ground and Hizbollah's forces have been training for almost 3 decades for just such an eventuality.

I always knew that on the ground, the Israelis were going to get pushed around by small teams of Hizbollah fighters. I am impressed that not only are they using their ATGMs effectively, but they are also threatening Israelis in the air with their MANPADS.

They have used them far more effectively than the Iranians inside of Iran.

I have been critical of our armed forces in the past, particularly about the US pilot rescue mission, but South of Lebanon is like 1/200th the size of Iran.

 

[Blain2]

The people of Pakistan, both Sunni and Shiite, are widely pro-Iran in this war and I don't doubt their sincerity in this. I don't think the same is true about the Pakistani system though. The situation is very complicated.

Why?

Do you understand the makeup of the Pakistani system? Just like Shias make up 30% of the population, they are just as well represented in the government, military, bureaucracy and the judiciary. Alhmadolillah, Shias are fully embedded in the Pakistani power structure. They make it to the very top and are included in the apex policy making bodies of Pakistan.

The Pakistani "system's" motivation is to stop the spread of this war. They do NOT want to be dragged into a war to support KSA against Iran given our defense treaty. If anyone just understands this motivation, it will become clear to them that Pakistan is not doing this at ANYONE's behest except for its own interests.

It is a disaster for Pakistan either way if KSA were to win and Iran were to lose or the other way around. One is a strategic partner, the other is a direct neighbor. So why in the world would Pakistan cater to goddamned American interests in this situation?

The only ones peddling this nonsense ("bakvas" in our vernacular) are the usual opponents of Pakistan here and elsewhere.

 

[Immortals]

Russians are leaving how much you bet the Israelis and trump are go to try to take the fuel in case they think the Iranians would use the spent fuel for a plutonium bomb

There is 210 tons of spent fuel rods on the site. I think Israel is going to bomb it this week once the deadline runs up.

These peripheral strikes are just warnings to the Russians to evacuate.

 

[Shags101]

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/no-injuries-after-drones-from-yemen-target-eilat-area/

Israelis can’t even pretend to stop drones anymore only ones they’re still pretending to stop are the Iranian ones

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Iran now needs to launch it's more powerful and advanced missiles on key israeli energy installations.

 

[Blain2]

I have been critical of our armed forces in the past, particularly about the US pilot rescue mission, but South of Lebanon is like 1/200th the size of Iran.

I get it but remember, the eventuality of aircraft/pilots going down was a certainty from the start of this campaign. Iran should have equipped more of its local forces with MANPADS etc. It actually was shocking that local troops were using small arms on low flying, slow aircraft. Water over the bridge now.