PAF Future Acquisition Plans

[ety]

I was watching a YouTube video where the YouTuber mentioned that this jet is comparable to Rafale, not the F-22. It's not a true 5th-generation fighter. How true is that?

If that's the case, why are PAF going to get J-31 ? Considering that PAF already have J-10 C comparable to Rafale.

 

[studsmart]

I was watching a YouTube video where the YouTuber mentioned that this jet is comparable to Rafale, not the F-22. It's not a true 5th-generation fighter. How true is that?

That YouTuber must be Indian . All kids knows that j31/35 and j20 are all 5th gen fighter in the same league of f22 or jsf35

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Personally I think Pakistan shouldn't rush 5th gen unless they perceive possible conflict in the near future, Pakistan's economy is in far more dire situation than it's security position IMO.

Gaza Genocide has shown everyday is like a yesterday as far as defense is concerned..

 

[CSAW]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1743427227629539798

 

[hyperman]

He provided features that may or may not exist in 2033 to compare against an existing platform with actual capabilities.

Ok but lets say they do exist, or when do get put into production and come out with an aircraft that has all those things, how would that compare? design wise?

It currently uses an interim WS-13, just like J-20 uses an interim WS-10A. I don't expect WS-19 to be ready until 2027.

J-20s use WS-10C not WS-10A anymore, they are far beyond that phase, the WS-15 is set to be in low rate production this year. Testing is completed according to Chinese engineers working on the project, there was a conference a few months back where one of them spoke, it was in Chinese, there is a translation video somewhere, ask Deino, he would know.

Indeed.. And thats why I was telling the person claiming that Pakistan can induct J-31 this year only as hoax. It will take some time even if deal is signed right now.

Idk when they will get to Pakistan but the WS-19 will likely be ready before 2027, Idk where they pulled that year out. we are seeing them being tested on J-31s already(Deino posted a pic a few days back), and chinese observers mentioned that they should be in production not too far after the new aircraft carrier is commisioned, considering they are supposed to be part of its air wing.

 

[S10]

Indeed.. And thats why I was telling the person claiming that Pakistan can induct J-31 this year only as hoax. It will take some time even if deal is signed right now.

They can start inducting it this year, but they will need an engine change in 2 to 3 years. If they inducted now it will be a gimped version with reduced speed/maneuverability due to WS-13.

Ok but lets say they do exist, or when do get put into production and come out with an aircraft that has all those things, how would that compare? design wise?

It would be roughly comparable to what J-31 has currently, with perhaps better thrust to weight ratio. The problem is J-31 won't stop receiving upgrades and you're talking about a decade down the road. China's 6th generation fighter will likely be unveiled by late 2020's and ready for service by mid 2030's.

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

They can start inducting it this year, but they will need an engine change in 2 to 3 years. If they inducted now it will be a gimped version with reduced speed/maneuverability due to WS-13.

How can we we start inducting j31/J35 in this year when j31/J35 still in a testing and trial phase and its testing yet to be completed

 

[hyperman]

It would be roughly comparable to what J-31 has currently, with perhaps better thrust to weight ratio. The problem is J-31 won't stop receiving upgrades and you're talking about a decade down the road. China's 6th generation fighter will likely be unveiled by late 2020's and ready for service by mid 2030's.

Why wouldn't it be more comparable to the J-20 rather than the J-31?

There seem to be far more dedicated sensors on the KAAN than the J-31, plus China is building it for export and to be far less expensive than the J-20. The price points on the J-20 and KAAN are similar.

 

[S10]

How can we we start inducting j31/J35 in this year when j31/J35 still in a testing and trial phase and its testing yet to be completed

J-35 is in testing for carrier operation. J-31 has long been finalized (prototype flew in 2013 and design was heavily modified in 2019) and was just looking for a customer.

Why wouldn't it be more comparable to the J-20 rather than the J-31?

There seem to be far more dedicated sensors on the KAAN than the J-31, plus China is building it for export and to be far less expensive than the J-20. The price points on the J-20 and KAAN are similar.

What specific future sensor will the TK-X have that cannot be found on J-31 currently?

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

J-35 is in testing for carrier operation. J-31 has long been finalized (prototype flew in 2013 and design was heavily modified in 2019) and was just looking for a customer.

PLAAF/ SAC still testing j31/J35, first customer will be your PLAN not some foreign customers

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

What specific future sensor will the TK-X have that cannot be found on J-31 currently?

In weight categories both are in different leagues J-31/J35 is medium weight jet can't carry much payloads like F35 with limited range

Whereas KAAN will heavyweight fighter jet like F-22/J-20/Su-57 and capable to carry heavy payloads

 

[studsmart]

Converting f/a-18 from carrier based to land based was not that difficult case of Canada. Except landing gear and few wing folding mods everything remains same .... I am not sure what is this so much noise of building j31 from scratch for paf

 

[hyperman]

What specific future sensor will the TK-X have that cannot be found on J-31 currently?

Well for one, there are 4 AESA sensors, 2 on the sides, and one on the back next to the engines for 360 coverage. Then there is both an EOTS for ground applications as well as a dedicated IRST sensor. There is also a DIRCM sensor. Thats just sensors, there is also a HMDS like the F-35, thought we haven't seen the inside of the J-31 so I can't say for sure if the Chinese have gone for a HMDS as well or a traditional HUD like the J-20 currently uses. There are several other key semi autonomous features regarding landing and takeoff but that might be there on the J-31 as well. its difficult the gauge the J-31 given both China's lack of transparency as well as not too much exposure during testing, but if the export price points are accurate of the jet(it might end up being more in which case its different), idk how they will put all those aspects in and keep it at the low price point and all the features, as it costs almost half the J-20 price apparently. around $70M vs $120M for the J-20. To put in perspective the JAS GripenE is $85M. I understand China makes things cheaper, but that cost/price, there must be somewhere they are cutting back.

 

[enroger]

Gaza Genocide has shown everyday is like a yesterday as far as defense is concerned..

I wouldn't put it past the Americans to have issued another "Bomb you to the stone age" threat over Israel in 2023/24 as they did over Afghanistan in 2001.

Or maybe Israel itself issued the threat. They are desperate to start WWIII, because if the war continues like this they will soon be leaving Palestine like the Soviets left Afghanistan.

I won't argue against your security concerns, they're no doubt valid. I'd prioritize economy because 1) Better economy buys you a better army later on and 2) Pakistan's economy in particular is in a bad shape.

But I do agree the world is getting crazier by the day, so who knows maybe this is the right decision after all.

 

[enroger]

To put in perspective the JAS GripenE is $85M. I understand China makes things cheaper, but that cost/price, there must be somewhere they are cutting back.

And F-35 costs 89M, Gripen is just overpriced. You're forgetting economy of scale, J-35 will have at least 3-400 orders from PLAN alone, and who knows how many if PLAAF also purchase it.