HAL LCA Tejas: Updates, News & Discussions

[kmc_chacko]

The same reason why you indians can't replace all your Mig-21s like-for-like with anything else, it's down to cost. That's the whole point of the lightweight fighter, a cheap way to get a significant number of airframes into service, adding enhanced capability as you go along with further development. The J10C is in the same class as the Viper, M2K, etc. i.e. medium-weight, not lightweight.

Yes it is true unlike PAF, IAF was not able to replace all of Mig-21s & 23s with anything, its mainly because hard stand of IAF, instead of wafting for FOC & NOCs IAF should have went ahead of acquiring Tejas in batches since 2007, then by now IAF would have added 200+ fighter jets.

Its mainly due to IAF interest in having Dassault Mirage and they wanted plane with such caliber should enter & replace Mig-21s. I think IAF is seeing Mk1A as the true successor for Mig-21s & 23s and streamline of production line will encourage IAF to speed up things towards Mk2.

 

[TopGun786]

JF-17 is a 3rd generation fighter jet, derived from the MiG-21. Tejas and Rafale are 4th generation fighter jets. India is currently developing a new fighter jet that aims to be as affordable as the JF-17. This new jet, known as the HF-24 Marut, will feature a metal body instead of the carbon composite body used in the Tejas. Additionally, it will not have a delta wing design like the Tejas, allowing it to be powered by a less powerful engine.

The guy is still living under rock.
Whenever I see him posting I knew he will be uttering a new "bongi".

 

[Corax]

Yes it is true unlike PAF, IAF was not able to replace all of Mig-21s & 23s with anything, its mainly because hard stand of IAF, instead of wafting for FOC & NOCs IAF should have went ahead of acquiring Tejas in batches since 2007, then by now IAF would have added 200+ fighter jets.

Its mainly due to IAF interest in having Dassault Mirage and they wanted plane with such caliber should enter & replace Mig-21s. I think IAF is seeing Mk1A as the true successor for Mig-21s & 23s and streamline of production line will encourage IAF to speed up things towards Mk2.

Well if you had acquired the license and production line for the M2K back when you had the chance instead of developing the tejas, you wouldn't be in such a predicament. Haven't any of you noticed how the development of the tejas is stretching its airframe to be "mediumweight", i.e. basically in the same class as the M2K!!? the problem with you is that you're trying to reinvent the wheel, instead of focusing on actually having a capable platform in service in significant numbers.

That's where the genius of previous PAF leaders comes into play now, like ACM Mushaf Ali Mir who decided to decouple the development of the FC-1/JF-17's airframe from its avionics and weapons. It meant that by the time the airframe development was matured (incorporating an open architecture approach), it could rapidly then integrate the latest contemporary avionics and weapons easily. There was a time when the JF-17 was going to have all French avionics and weapons like the Mica, but ultimately politics, costs, corruption and other factors led to that idea being abandoned. Eventually the PAF was satisfied with advances made my Chinese solutions to adopt, and include only non-critical western solutions.

 

[silicon0000]

JF-17 is a 3rd generation fighter jet, derived from the MiG-21. Tejas and Rafale are 4th generation fighter jets. India is currently developing a new fighter jet that aims to be as affordable as the JF-17. This new jet, known as the HF-24 Marut, will feature a metal body instead of the carbon composite body used in the Tejas. Additionally, it will not have a delta wing design like the Tejas, allowing it to be powered by a less powerful engine.

Wrong, Plain wrong.
Tejas is 40th Gen Fighter, not 4th Gen.

So the Block III JF-17 with AESA, MAWS is 3rd gen? so that means tejas MK2 must be third gen as well then? the only reference to JF-17 being third gen is by Chinese sources, because their "generation" definition is one class behind the Western convention, i.e. their 3rd gen is Western 4th gen. But I wouldn't expect someone like you to understand that putra

Dear what you are saying is way above his level.

“Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ................ Mark Twain.

 

[kmc_chacko]

Well if you had acquired the license and production line for the M2K back when you had the chance instead of developing the tejas, you wouldn't be in such a predicament. Haven't any of you noticed how the development of the tejas is stretching its airframe to be "mediumweight", i.e. basically in the same class as the M2K!!? the problem with you is that you're trying to reinvent the wheel, instead of focusing on actually having a capable platform in service in significant numbers.

That's where the genius of previous PAF leaders comes into play now, like ACM Mushaf Ali Mir who decided to decouple the development of the FC-1/JF-17's airframe from its avionics and weapons. It meant that by the time the airframe development was matured (incorporating an open architecture approach), it could rapidly then integrate the latest contemporary avionics and weapons easily. There was a time when the JF-17 was going to have all French avionics and weapons like the Mica, but ultimately politics, costs, corruption and other factors led to that idea being abandoned. Eventually the PAF was satisfied with advances made my Chinese solutions to adopt, and include only non-critical western solutions.

Not acquiring M2K back then had both positive & negative impacts on IAF.

Negative is we are short of fighters i.e., we could have added 300+ M2K and retired Mig-21, 23 & 27s much earlier and saved lot of valuable lives.

Positive is development of Tejas and development of aero industry around it. Had we gone with M2K induction of Rafael wouldn't have happened.

one good thing PAF did was buying JF-17 at that time when even it was inferior to F-16s of PAF, but still I believe instead of JF-17, PAF should have gone with J-10s, since it has secured future compared to JF-17s.

 

[Pataliputra]

India has modified its British Jaguar fighter jets by upgrading them with AESA radar, but that doesn’t elevate them to the level of 4th generation fighters like Tejas and Rafale. Despite the upgrades, Jaguar remains a 3rd generation fighter due to its old design, which inherently limits how much can be improved. Similarly, JF-17 is also a 3rd generation design, even with the addition of an AESA radar—not to mention, its frugal air-cooled AESA radar further limits its performance.

 

[silicon0000]

Guys This is Tejas Thread.

 

[Corax]

India has modified its British Jaguar fighter jets by upgrading them with AESA radar, but that doesn’t elevate them to the level of 4th generation fighters like Tejas and Rafale. Despite the upgrades, Jaguar remains a 3rd generation fighter due to its old design, which inherently limits how much can be improved. Similarly, JF-17 is also a 3rd generation design, even with the addition of an AESA radar—not to mention, its frugal air-cooled AESA radar further limits its performance.

Makes your whole argument about "generations" moot then! Lol you can call the tejus 40th gen for all that it matters, that doesn't mean it's more capable than say an almost 50 year old Block 15 F-16.

 

[Pataliputra]

Makes your whole argument about "generations" moot then! Lol you can call the tejus 40th gen for all that it matters, that doesn't mean it's more capable than say an almost 50 year old Block 15 F-16.

Indian Air Force rejected F-16 in MMRCA 2008, deeming it obsolete. Instead, they shortlisted Rafale and Eurofighter. IAF is purchasing Tejas MK1A in large numbers not because it's indigenous, but because it meets their requirements and is future-proof.

 

[Corax]

Indian Air Force rejected F-16 in MMRCA 2008, deeming it obsolete. Instead, they shortlisted Rafale and Eurofighter. IAF is purchasing Tejas MK1A in large numbers not because it's indigenous, but because it meets their requirements and is future-proof.

Really, the Block-70 Viper offered to imdia is obsolete?! Ok buddy lol are you sure it wasn't because the IAF would be at a disadvantage given that the PAF has been operating the Viper for over 40 years? It would be like the PAF acquiring the Su-30.

 

[Pataliputra]

Really, the Block-70 Viper offered to imdia is obsolete?! Ok buddy lol are you sure it wasn't because the IAF would be at a disadvantage given that the PAF has been operating the Viper for over 40 years? It would be like the PAF acquiring the Su-30.

Definitely not. When asked why they rejected F-16, the Indian Air Force categorically stated that it was because the jet is obsolete. IAF only wants to purchase fighter jets that are future-proof.

 

[Deino]

The design of JF-17 is third generation because it's a derivative of MiG-21. 4th generation fighter jets like Tejas, Rafale, Gripen, and Eurofighter Typhoon feature designs optimized for a low radar cross section and make extensive use of carbon composites in their airframes. For example, Tejas has a 90% carbon composite airframe, and Gripen uses 45%, whereas MiG-21 and JF-17 primarily have metallic bodies.

Are you really that dumb? Yes, the program which led to the JF-17 was initiated as a J-7-based design, but the JF-17 today has nothing in common and is a totalyl independent design.

As such spare this BS only to feel good.

Definitely not. When asked why they rejected F-16, the Indian Air Force categorically stated that it was because the jet is obsolete. IAF only wants to purchase fighter jets that are future-proof.

And the Tejas should be?

 

[Pataliputra]

Modern 4th generation fighter jets are easily distinguishable from 3rd generation or older 4th generation jets. modern jets (Tejas, Eurofighter Typhoon, Rafale, and Gripen) feature a delta wing design, with wing blending into the fuselage. due to extensive use of carbon composites, Tejas has larger air intakes for cooling.

 

[Pataliputra]

Are you really that dumb? Yes, the program which led to the JF-17 was initiated as a J-7-based design, but the JF-17 today has nothing in common and is a totalyl independent design.

As such spare this BS only to feel good.



And the Tejas should be?

You have dismissed the statement made by the serving Indian Air Force Chief during an official press conference as propaganda and a lie, which reflects poorly on your understanding. The serving Indian Air Force Chief cannot make propaganda statements, they are accountable to the Indian government and responsible for protecting India's airspace. If they were to make a propaganda statement, they would face severe consequences, including the possibility of being removed from their position.

 

[Pataliputra]

When Indian Air Force rejects F-16, calling it obsolete, and chose to purchase Tejas MK1A in large numbers, there decision is based purely on technical evaluation. The decision to reject F16 was not influenced by propaganda or the fact that the Pakistani Air Force operates F-16. As I mentioned earlier, IAF shortlists fighter jets based on their technical specifications, not on media narratives.