Iranian Air Force (IRIAF/IRGC-ASF) | News and Discussions

[tsunset]

you see integrating Hawk into f-14 is old news from 80s iran abandoned that project and built fakour
by the way why you think Iran is interested in S-400

Even more S-300PMU2 would be good for Iran, let alone S-400

Shuffle the IADS with air defenses made from different countries like China does, they have their own but mix it with Russian systems

It is better to have systems from multiple sources mixed with homemade ones than only homemade, when its flaws will be shown to the enemy, you have nothing else to switch on

 

[tsunset]

I don't think China fears US sanctions but it dosnt see it as important as giving Iranians fighter jets l.

It make the choice between conserving its non-sanctioned statut and good economics and trade with all the world and selling Iran modern fighter jets, which will undoubtedly come with a sanction package from the US

They already made the "normal" choice just like Pakistan, otherwise JF-17 and J-10C would have been ordered by Iran in good numbers

 

[Persian Gulf]

Come on, maaan. lol. I'm not going to look for articles from the past 20 years that I kind 'of remember the Iranian ADS interested in acquiring the S-400.

Suffice it to say when we first saw the S-300pmu being paraded through Tehran way back in 2010 I believe, there was a lot of talk about the next step being the S-400 and of course it makes all the sense in the world. How often has Iran been threatened by the zionist piglets with attacks on its nuclear facilities? And what better system would be available for Iran to help defend against that? 2+2 ma bro.

doesn't make sense to spend billions on s-400 when iran already has S-300pmu2 and Bavar-373 (with 300km+ range Sayyad-4B SAM) and Mehran (with 320km range Mehran-2 SAM) and is working on upgraded version of Bavar-373 in s-400 class

 

[warking2005]

It make the choice between conserving its non-sanctioned statut and good economics and trade with all the world and selling Iran modern fighter jets, which will undoubtedly come with a sanction package from the US

They already made the "normal" choice just like Pakistan, otherwise JF-17 and J-10C would have been ordered by Iran in good numbers

Well I hope iran looks for domestic solutions remember sanctions might weaken a country but in long term they make it free.

 

[Immortals]

Well I hope iran looks for domestic solutions.

How many countries have made 100% fighter jet with no foreign major components? 3? (US, Russia, China)

Everyone else uses some % of US/NATO tech or China tech. For example: Turkey TFX, South Korea next gen fighter, and Japan next Gen. Fighter all use tech from US and European companies. Iran doesn’t have that luxury.

So it’s not as easy as saying “domestic solutions” and viola you got a fighter jet. Nor is it as easy as throwing $$$$ at the project to overcome technological bottlenecks and shortcomings.

 

[HamidAgha]

How many countries have made 100% fighter jet with no foreign major components? 3? (US, Russia, China)

Everyone else uses some % of US/NATO tech or China tech. For example: Turkey TFX, South Korea next gen fighter, and Japan next Gen. Fighter all use tech from US and European companies. Iran doesn’t have that luxury.

So it’s not as easy as saying “domestic solutions” and viola you got a fighter jet. Nor is it as easy as throwing $$$$ at the project to overcome technological bottlenecks and shortcomings.

Western and Chinese tech I can understand, but when the choice is Russian or domestic, a lot on here would go with domestic.

 

[Zarathustra]

Western and Chinese tech I can understand, but when the choice is Russian or domestic, a lot on here would go with domestic.

I reckon most would take Russian with ToT

 

[Flames In The Desert]

How many countries have made 100% fighter jet with no foreign major components? 3? (US, Russia, China)

Everyone else uses some % of US/NATO tech or China tech. For example: Turkey TFX, South Korea next gen fighter, and Japan next Gen. Fighter all use tech from US and European companies. Iran doesn’t have that luxury.

So it’s not as easy as saying “domestic solutions” and viola you got a fighter jet. Nor is it as easy as throwing $$$$ at the project to overcome technological bottlenecks and shortcomings.

In the case of something like an indigenous fighter the question would be:
Is it worth the large amounts of money and other resources that would have to be dedicated to the project in order to achieve its goal?
I think the obvious answer to that is clearly No

I think that ultimately the biggest problem for the iriaf has been a distinct lack of competent leadership,and until there is a competent leadership that can envisage achievable goals that will enhance the capabilities of the airforce,and can then come up with realistic plans to make those goals into a reality,well I dont see the iriaf really going anywhere.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Even more S-300PMU2 would be good for Iran, let alone S-400

Shuffle the IADS with air defenses made from different countries like China does, they have their own but mix it with Russian systems

It is better to have systems from multiple sources mixed with homemade ones than only homemade, when its flaws will be shown to the enemy, you have nothing else to switch on

give the money to defense ministry to provide local Air defense at least they use AESA not like S-400 and S-300 that don't have it or use hybrid solution

but that is irrelevant , Iran shown no interest in foreign long range air defense , do you have any information contrary to that

 

[Hack-Hook]

I think that ultimately the biggest problem for the iriaf has been a distinct lack of competent leadership,and until there is a competent leadership that can envisage achievable goals that will enhance the capabilities of the airforce,and can then come up with realistic plans to make those goals into a reality,well I dont see the iriaf really going anywhere.

the problem is distinct lack of money not competent leadership

 

[Immortals]

the problem is distinct lack of money not competent leadership

Money is just one issue.

If [adding] money was the source of all tech break thrus, than we would already have scalable Fusion reactors, gravity manipulating warp drives, and cure for various cancers. Learning universal knowledge takes time even in a state of unlimited funding.

You can give Iranian engineers $1B/yr or $10B/yr to build an AL-31 engine domestically and they could still fail in both scenarios for first 5 years or 10 years or even more.

More Money helps speed up additional research and experimentation, but doesn’t lead to magical breakthrus in a society that lacks the fundamental knowledge required. Fundamental knowledge is limited by progression of human collective intellect (ie time).

 

[Hack-Hook]

Money is just one issue.

If [adding] money was the source of all tech break thrus, than we would already have scalable Fusion reactors, gravity manipulating warp drives, and cure for various cancers. Learning universal knowledge takes time even in a state of unlimited funding.

You can give Iranian engineers $1B/yr or $10B/yr to build an AL-31 engine domestically and they could still fail in both scenarios for first 5 years or 10 years or even more.

More Money helps speed up additional research and experimentation, but doesn’t lead to magical breakthrus in a society that lacks the fundamental knowledge required. Fundamental knowledge is limited by progression of human collective intellect (ie time).

lack of money for 40 years hamper research and development , nobody provide air force anything on discount they had to pay for it . its also the case of defense ministry.
on other hand another organization have several time more money a lot less force and......

 

[Immortals]

lack of money for 40 years hamper research and development , nobody provide air force anything on discount they had to pay for it . its also the case of defense ministry.
on other hand another organization have several time more money a lot less force and......

Air Force doesn’t develop the required turbine blade construction required for jet engines nor does DM. That comes from university and government military research facilties. That’s just one variable in the thousands of variables required to get to jet engine finished product.

Many advanced country could can build 1 or 5 jet engine prototypes as Nazi Germany showed with various cutting edge (at the time) prototypes. But building 1,000+ reliable efficient jet engines with good working life and do so at reasonable cost is another matter entirely. Add in infrastructure costs for that mass production and project management chains and logistics chains and it’s a nightmare to get up and running.

Another point, Missile force had the most $$$$ invested and in 25 years is just now (last 5 year) is starting to move away from smaller diameter engines and moving to more powerful engines and more modern engine designs.

So by your logic, Iran should have had Fattah 1&2 pre-2010 or Khorramshahr-4 because that branch (missile force) gets lion share of funds.

Again it’s a fallacy. Plenty of rich countries out there that lack ability to build scalable cost efficient specialized high tech products.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Air Force doesn’t develop the required turbine blade construction required for jet engines nor does DM. That comes from university and government military research facilties. That’s just one variable in the thousands of variables required to get to jet engine finished product.

Many advanced country could can build 1 or 5 jet engine prototypes as Nazi Germany showed with various cutting edge (at the time) prototypes. But building 1,000+ reliable efficient jet engines with good working life and do so at reasonable cost is another matter entirely. Add in infrastructure costs for that mass production and project management chains and logistics chains and it’s a nightmare to get up and running.

Another point, Missile force had the most $$$$ invested and in 25 years is just now (last 5 year) is starting to move away from smaller diameter engines and moving to more powerful engines and more modern engine designs.

So by your logic, Iran should have had Fattah 1&2 pre-2010 or Khorramshahr-4 because that branch (missile force) gets lion share of funds.

Again it’s a fallacy. Plenty of rich countries out there that lack ability to build scalable cost efficient specialized high tech products.

the university and private sector must see a need to produce something .
when air force and defense ministry don't have the money to order new transport , for who industry must build it.
by my logic if the amount of money spent on air-force would have been spent on missiles then today we had shahab-3a

 

[Immortals]

the university and private sector must see a need to produce something .
when air force and defense ministry don't have the money to order new transport , for who industry must build it.
by my logic if the amount of money spent on air-force would have been spent on missiles then today we had shahab-3a

The issue is 5th Gen jet is point Z and Iran is maybe at point F or G in process, there is a lot of knowledge & iterative technologies it needs to learn THEN master at scale before assembling a finished product (fighter jet).

Countries like Turkey or South Korea can sign ToT deals or licensing deals and import whatever technology/part/subsystem on A to Z journey that they haven’t mastered or it’s too consuming to master. They can employ hundreds of experienced foreign technical advisors to aid their domestic engineers and mechanics during the process. The other path is Countries like China seek to “steal” it from those that already did the long work alongside their own development path.

Iran cannot do Turkey route and struggles to efficiently do the China route. You can Google to see how many busts have happened preventing game changing tech from being transported to Iran. One engineer was caught trying to smuggle F-35 engine blueprints to Iran. Obviously Iran wouldn’t be asking for such data if it didn’t think it had a use for them.
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