Israel’s Genocide in Gaza | 2023- till present

[unconventional]

Israel did not defeat Hamas. Israel has not won.

But does not mean Hamas have won. If the measure of victory for Hamas is not getting dismantled by Israel, that is a pretty low bar.

Certainly the Palestinian people have not won, in fact they are the biggest losers of this conflict.

If the Arab world is serious for a two-state solution; then there is no need for the axis of resistance, or defeating Israel.

If the two-state solution is dead, then serious actions need to take place by all parties (including the whole Arab world, not just the axis of resistance) to defeat Israel.

That is the tragedy for Palestinians. There is no one in the Arab world that can/or wants to force a two-state solution, and no one from the axis of resistance that can defeat Israel militarily.

 

[Hassan Al-Somal]

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[Hassan Al-Somal]

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[_Arabia_]

Israel did not defeat Hamas. Israel has not won.

But does not mean Hamas have won. If the measure of victory for Hamas is not getting dismantled by Israel, that is a pretty low bar.

Certainly the Palestinian people have not won, in fact they are the biggest losers of this conflict.

If the Arab world is serious for a two-state solution; then there is no need for the axis of resistance, or defeating Israel.

If the two-state solution is dead, then serious actions need to take place by all parties (including the whole Arab world, not just the axis of resistance) to defeat Israel.

That is the tragedy for Palestinians. There is no one in the Arab world that can/or wants to force a two-state solution, and no one from the axis of resistance that can defeat Israel militarily.

I am genuinely curious what you and other non-Arabs expect this "Arab world" (as in 20 + nation states each with 20 + distinct regimes and agendas) to do in order to FORCE upon Israel and de facto the entire US/West/NATO the creation of a Palestinian state?

How will you connect isolated Gaza with the remaining West Bank that each year is losing land to illegal settlements and itself has been a "Bantustan" for years upon years?

On the ground there is no concept of a unified West Bank.



How are you going to militarily defeat a nuclear-armed Israel in the first place? Not only nuclear-armed but by design (courtesy of the US and West) have been equipped with the best conventional weapons in the region?

Economically not possible either as long as the US and West are bankrolling Israel.

Politically we have seen for the past 77 years that nothing seems to work either.

If the last almost 1.5 years have not shown everyone that Israel is immune politically, militarily and in terms of media coverage, I do not know.

Who has imposed any sanctions upon Israel? Has China or Russia done anything of notice?

Pakistan is the only Muslim nation that can defeat Israel by virtue of nukes. Nowhere to be seen.

Arabs (regimes here) used to totally boycott Israel for decades upon decades until Egypt became the first country to have official diplomatic relations with Israel. Nothing changed during that time.

The oil embargo (largest economic attack on the West collectively in modern history) led by KSA did not change anything/status quo either.

So if anyone has any realistic solutions that would force upon Israel a two-state solution, please tell us, because as of now I don't see any such solutions.

 

[LeGenD]

Israel did not defeat Hamas. Israel has not won.

But does not mean Hamas have won. If the measure of victory for Hamas is not getting dismantled by Israel, that is a pretty low bar.

Certainly the Palestinian people have not won, in fact they are the biggest losers of this conflict.

If the Arab world is serious for a two-state solution; then there is no need for the axis of resistance, or defeating Israel.

If the two-state solution is dead, then serious actions need to take place by all parties (including the whole Arab world, not just the axis of resistance) to defeat Israel.

That is the tragedy for Palestinians. There is no one in the Arab world that can/or wants to force a two-state solution, and no one from the axis of resistance that can defeat Israel militarily.

Many are war-weary understandably because modern-age wars are increasingly difficult and costly to fight. No stable country wants to experience death and destruction, particularly on the level in Gaza. Even those who live in Gaza want peace, there protests show it. Hamas has outdated policy that will not work. Egypt is pushing for a new deal between Israel and Gaza. I am not sure what type of solution will work but there should be a strong push for peaceful co-existence between all groups in the region.

 

[Developereo]

Israel did not defeat Hamas. Israel has not won.

But does not mean Hamas have won. If the measure of victory for Hamas is not getting dismantled by Israel, that is a pretty low bar.

Certainly the Palestinian people have not won, in fact they are the biggest losers of this conflict.

If the Arab world is serious for a two-state solution; then there is no need for the axis of resistance, or defeating Israel.

If the two-state solution is dead, then serious actions need to take place by all parties (including the whole Arab world, not just the axis of resistance) to defeat Israel.

That is the tragedy for Palestinians. There is no one in the Arab world that can/or wants to force a two-state solution, and no one from the axis of resistance that can defeat Israel militarily.

The Balfour Declaration was just the beginning (*). The British didn't just lay the foundation stone for Israel; they ensured its continued survival by dividing the Arabs into a dozen countries which are constantly at odds with each other. Arab resources were divided into a dozen countries competing with each other rather than be pooled against Israel.

(*) As payment for dragging the US into WW1.

 

[_Arabia_]

Many are war-weary understandably because modern-age wars are increasingly difficult and costly to fight. No stable country wants to experience death and destruction, particularly on the level in Gaza. Even those who live in Gaza want peace, there protests show it. Hamas has outdated policy that will not work. Egypt is pushing for a new deal between Israel and Gaza. I am not sure what type of solution will work but there should be a strong push for peaceful co-existence between all groups in the region.

I think that we need to come to terms with the fact that the two-state solution is dead and buried. If you look at the ground in the West Bank and examine facts, first the fact that the West Bank is totally dotted with illegal Israeli settlements (see the map that I posted), secondly that the West Bank is ruled by corrupt Fatah (who are actively collaborating with Israel), what can any outsiders do exactly? Even in some alternative universe, where Jordan to attack the West Bank to try to force upon the locals a new regime, they would be attacking the Jordanians as in the past. Jordanians used to control the West Bank. They were forced out and left it to locals. PLO later evolved into what we have today, a useless Mahmoud Abbas and a equally useless Fatah who are openly collaborating with Israel. Seeing all this, is it really that strange that certain Arab and Muslim regimes have given up and accepted status quo? Who can blame the likes of Morocco and UAE (if we look past all personal feelings and opinions and just accept that states and regimes are just "in it" for their own state interests and solely that) that they have established ties with Israel and in certain ways benefit from this? What can Hamas and Fatah offer them in return?

Look, this is not my personal opinion but if you are brutally honest those are the facts on the ground.

 

[hussain0216]

I am genuinely curious what you and other non-Arabs expect this "Arab world" (as in 20 + nation states each with 20 + distinct regimes and agendas) to do in order to FORCE upon Israel and de facto the entire US/West/NATO the creation of a Palestinian state?

How will you connect isolated Gaza with the remaining West Bank that each year is losing land to illegal settlements and itself has been a "Bantustan" for years upon years?

On the ground there is no concept of a unified West Bank.

View attachment 110113

How are you going to militarily defeat a nuclear-armed Israel in the first place? Not only nuclear-armed but by design (courtesy of the US and West) have been equipped with the best conventional weapons in the region?

Economically not possible either as long as the US and West are bankrolling Israel.

Politically we have seen for the past 77 years that nothing seems to work either.

If the last almost 1.5 years have not shown everyone that Israel is immune politically, militarily and in terms of media coverage, I do not know.

Who has imposed any sanctions upon Israel? Has China or Russia done anything of notice?

Pakistan is the only Muslim nation that can defeat Israel by virtue of nukes. Nowhere to be seen.

Arabs (regimes here) used to totally boycott Israel for decades upon decades until Egypt became the first country to have official diplomatic relations with Israel. Nothing changed during that time.

The oil embargo (largest economic attack on the West collectively in modern history) led by KSA did not change anything/status quo either.

So if anyone has any realistic solutions that would force upon Israel a two-state solution, please tell us, because as of now I don't see any such solutions.

Isolate Israel
Refuse and ban any normalisation with a apartheid state in your midst
Declare sanctions against any company that does business with Israel will be banned from doing business anywhere in the Arab world
Refuse and ban any U.S or weapons from any state arming Israel

Invest in home grown alternatives or link up with China and Russia

Build a ACTUAL military plan, identify Israeli targets and obtain weapons that can hit those targets

Completely and utterly economically, politically, isolate and ban Israel


Arabs could have done so much, beyond becoming cucolds for the U.S

 

[hussain0216]

It's not too late,,,
Israel is a hated and despised entity

The U.S is becoming a joke of a state,

Multiple Arab states need to take steps, more then ever China is a great alternative to work with and the Muslim world finally has growing industries of its own to invest in

 

[LeGenD]

It's not too late,,,
Israel is a hated and despised entity

The U.S is becoming a joke of a state,

Multiple Arab states need to take steps, more then ever China is a great alternative to work with and the Muslim world finally has growing industries of its own to invest in

Israel is not a hated and despised entity but one of the largest economies.

https://oec.world/en/profile/country/isr

Israel has high tech industries that have global value.

The US was not a joke and will not be a joke. The joke is on politicians in smaller or less powerful countries who talk big for public consumption but have talks with the US to be soft on them behind-the-scenes. Many countries in the WEST are simply advanced with high tech industries and large markets that all want to tap. The US provides valuable technology and business to most of the countries in the world. Trump has some tough positions but American and European interests generally overlap and will continue. Many countries do not make decisions on the basis of religious narratives but on the basis of cost-benefit analysis.

 

[Aziqbal]

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hear me out on this first its a long one

when in 1099 the Crusaders killed every muslim women and children in Jerusalem it was because Christians were strong and Muslims were weak

but no Empire remains a Superpower forever their lives are finite not infinite

Allah Swt Bless Saladin was merciful and spared the Christian women and children but at the Battle of Hittin he killed over 600,000 Crusades, the historians say when you looked at the living Crusaders you couldn't ever image any one of them would ever die and when you look at them after Saladin was done you couldn't imagine anyone of them was alive

a total wipe out clean cut victory

In 1099 many Armenians joined the massacre of the muslims in Jerusalem and around 1000 years later the Ottoman killed 2 million of them known as the Armenien Genocide

When Vlad the impaler killed 20,000 Muslims the Ottomans impaled 200,000 Christians in Transylvania, historians say there was more impaled Christians than trees and Transylvania is known for its vast forests , this was because Sultan Mehmed II ordered it

today the Western nations kill because they are strong tomorrow they will suffer when they are weak and islam is strong

history will repeat itself and a Islamic Superpower will kill 10x the number of Israelis

only 1,2000 Israelis were killed and in return they destroyed a nation and killed 120,000 Palestinian is this a proportionate response ?

they do this so the price for killing Jews is high, not because Hamas hide in civilian areas but because they dont want this kind of thing to happen again and they want everyone to know the price for killing Jews , they want everyone to stare in horror and scare everyone

1 Jews = 100 Palestinians that's the price tag they have decided so no one dares to attack Israel again

but they always forget that with power comes responsibility and with that responsibility comes consequences

do you think anyone in the islamic world will ever forget what they have done in Gaza ? will a any muslims forget what they did in Gaza

its may take 50 years it could take 500 years but these Westerners have essentially signed the deaths warrants of their future progeny and coming generation

they have made enemies for their own grandchildren

when the islamic Empire rises from the ashes not only will Israelis cry but the land will speak on their behalf

This is the way the world works and Inshallah victory is only for the Muslims

 

[LeGenD]

Isolate Israel
Refuse and ban any normalisation with a apartheid state in your midst
Declare sanctions against any company that does business with Israel will be banned from doing business anywhere in the Arab world
Refuse and ban any U.S or weapons from any state arming Israel

Invest in home grown alternatives or link up with China and Russia

Build a ACTUAL military plan, identify Israeli targets and obtain weapons that can hit those targets

Completely and utterly economically, politically, isolate and ban Israel


Arabs could have done so much, beyond becoming cucolds for the U.S

This was the thought process during Cold War and it did not work or did it? On the contrary:

Israel continues to increase trade with Arab and Muslim world

Despite calls by Ireland, Spain, Belgium, Slovenia and others for the European Union to reconsider its trade relations with Israel due to its continued offensive against the Palestinians in Gaza, I…

www.middleeastmonitor.com

There is certainly the sentiment of upholding Two-State Solution but refer back to what I disclosed in here.

 

[hussain0216]

Israel is not a hated and despised entity but one of the largest economies.

https://oec.world/en/profile/country/isr

Israel has high tech industries that have global value.

The US was not a joke and will not be a joke. The joke is on politicians in smaller or less powerful countries who talk big for public consumption but have talks with the US to be soft on them behind-the-scenes. Many countries in the WEST are simply advanced with high tech industries and large markets that all want to tap. The US provides valuable technology and business to most of the countries in the world. Trump has some tough positions but American and European interests generally overlap and will continue. Many countries do not make decisions on the basis of religious narratives but on the basis of cost-benefit analysis.

Israel is despised, not for nothing the Jews are so upset at rising levels of anti-Semitism

Israel has natural problems, as a state it exists because of the U.S and without it, it ceases

Israel and Israeli products and supporter's should be boycotted and challenged everywhere

For as a much support Trump gives Israel, the BDS movement should work on the opposition

 

[_Arabia_]

Isolate Israel
Refuse and ban any normalisation with a apartheid state in your midst
Declare sanctions against any company that does business with Israel will be banned from doing business anywhere in the Arab world
Refuse and ban any U.S or weapons from any state arming Israel

Invest in home grown alternatives or link up with China and Russia

Build a ACTUAL military plan, identify Israeli targets and obtain weapons that can hit those targets

Completely and utterly economically, politically, isolate and ban Israel


Arabs could have done so much, beyond becoming cucolds for the U.S

Empty words. "Isolate Israel" as if Israel gives a flying **** about Arabs or Muslims as long as they have the complete and utter backing of the world's richest and most powerful nations (West) who they control and who they receive FREE money from.

The US alone is several times stronger militarily, economically and politically than the ENTIRE Muslim world combined. It is laughable.

I have said this 1000 billion times. The solution must be found in the US. They are the ones bankrolling and keeping Israel alive. Arabs or Muslims of the region cannot do anything militarily, politically or economically that will force Israel to accept a two-state solution. Something that they are not going to do anyway.

I don't think that you are familiar with the Zionist mindset and the mindset of most Jews after WW2. They will rather destroy the entire world (Samson option) than accept a two-state solution.

All this resistance nonsense is a joke frankly. The only thing that occurs is the mass murder of Palestinians and innocent civilians. Some rag tag militias (whatever their names) are not going to defeat Israel militarily ever.

The only Muslim nation that can militarily end Israel is Pakistan. Only due to nukes as well.

It is time to stop lying to ourselves and this charade of a "resistance" doing anything of notice on the ground.

Either you are serious (declaring all out war with all its consequences) or we stop this charade. Hamas, Hezbollah and similar groups are not going (ever) to change anything militarily or politically on the ground. If they could they would long ago have done it.

If Muslims are serious they must declare an all-out war with the entire West/NATO/USA. In such a war we absolutely need Pakistani nukes to enter the arena.

 

[hussain0216]

This was the thought process during Cold War and it did not work or did it? On the contrary:

Israel continues to increase trade with Arab and Muslim world

Despite calls by Ireland, Spain, Belgium, Slovenia and others for the European Union to reconsider its trade relations with Israel due to its continued offensive against the Palestinians in Gaza, I…

www.middleeastmonitor.com

There is certainly the sentiment of upholding Two-State Solution but refer back to what I disclosed in here.

It was half assed and Egypt, Jordan and others made deals under U.S support

The Arabs did this to themselves with their own behavior