PAF Future Acquisition Plans

[hyperman]

Keep at it. Nothing more precious than to pakistanis crying after things they never imagined will happen do happen. Annexation of kashmir comes to mind.

I'm not Pakistani. lol

 

[spammmmer]

they are not in the same class, The KAAN is a heavy fighter. the J-31 is a medium sized fighter.

Their use is absolutely same. Same specs same doctrine.

 

[hyperman]

Their use is absolutely same. Same specs same doctrine.

You don't seem like a serious aviation enthusiast. Saying the KAAN and the J-31 are the same is about as accurate as saying the F-15 and the F-18 are "absolutely same". Its two different class of fighters. A simple side by side would show you they are completely different dimensions. Not to mention the J-31 as of right now is a naval aircraft, we haven't seen the Air Force version b/c China isn't planning on inducting it, and instead building J-20s in mass.

 

[Zarvan]

1. J35 is navy's top project and airforce second after J20.
2. WS-19 is going very smoothly.
3. J35 is definitely not some second tier as it has many features that even J20 lacks (as per big shrimps), and the "export product is always inferior" doesn't applied anymore.

I really hope WS19 gets ready as soon as possible so when Pakistan gets first J-31 they are with ws19 engine.

 

[MastanKhan]

For imediate induction yes your are correct that J31 is the choice but there is no smoke screen for our own 5th Gen jet we are collaborating with Turkish brothers.

Hi,

The Original AZM or whatever program was a smoke screen---that started years ago---even before KAAN came into picture.

 

[spammmmer]

Hi,

The Original AZM or whatever program was a smoke screen---that started years ago---even before KAAN came into picture.

Hello
Do you think pakistan will induct both kaan and j31?
Is there any major difference between them if indeed both are getting inducted??
And which one would be better between the two?

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

MAY THE EYES OF COWARD NEVER SLEEP
Welcome to the Era of 5th Generation

 

[FuturePAF]

WS-19, WS-13 are old engines and RD-93 copies, the WS-19 is the one with goodies that the WS-15 has, its more akin to the newer GE414 variants that are in production.

I think the current 9.5-10 ton engine is designated WS-13E and the 11-12 ton engine is designated WS-19, and still about 2-4 years away, and will probably be given to the J-35 first before the export J-31.

 

[FuturePAF]

Hello
Do you think pakistan will induct both kaan and j31?
Is there any major difference between them if indeed both are getting inducted??
And which one would be better between the two?

KAAN is a heavy fighter with longer range.
J-31 is a medium fighter with 1200 km range.

 

[spammmmer]

KAAN is a heavy fighter with longer range.
J-31 is a medium fighter with 1200 km range.

Thats a stupid reason to buy two different fighters when you a small area to protect.

 

[hyperman]

Thats a stupid reason to buy two different fighters when you a small area to protect.

KAAN was designed as an air superiority fighter. The Chinese designed the J-31 as a multirole for export. Not sure if Pakistan will acquire both, but usually Air Forces try to buy a "high/low" package. The KAAN is a much more expensive aircraft for a specialized role, akin to the J-20s, whereas the J-31 is cheaper. The assumption is if they do buy the KAAN and the J-31s, there will be a lot less KAANs purchased, than J-31s. Idk what they decide, its up the Pakistanis to figure out.

Me personally i think they should purchase the J-31s as that will be ready and fully developed with a high performance Chinese engine before the KAAN is ready. They they shouldn't purchase too many J-31s, a couple squadron worth is really all they need for a specialized BVR role. They shouldn't purchase more J-10Cs either. The initial purchase was more than enough for their needs. They should upgrade their F-16s to F-16Vs or get the Turkish Ozgur package, and try to save money as there will be a plethora of development paths in the near future with many UAV platforms and wingmen like the Kizilelma and ANCA 3.

The Pakistani commentators I speak to on here, seem to want a 1 to 1 replacement for all their olf J-7s and Mirages that their air force flies, but IMO this is an old way of thinking, in the future you will have network centric warfare with 1 controlling platform(like the KAAN) managing several other autonomous/semi autonomous platforms with sensor fusion.

 

[Corax]

KAAN was designed as an air superiority fighter. The Chinese designed the J-31 as a multirole for export. Not sure if Pakistan will acquire both, but usually Air Forces try to buy a "high/low" package. The KAAN is a much more expensive aircraft for a specialized role, akin to the J-20s, whereas the J-31 is cheaper. The assumption is if they do buy the KAAN and the J-31s, there will be a lot less KAANs purchased, than J-31s. Idk what they decide, its up the Pakistanis to figure out.

Me personally i think they should purchase the J-31s as that will be ready and fully developed with a high performance Chinese engine before the KAAN is ready. They they shouldn't purchase too many J-31s, a couple squadron worth is really all they need for a specialized BVR role. They shouldn't purchase more J-10Cs either. The initial purchase was more than enough for their needs. They should upgrade their F-16s to F-16Vs or get the Turkish Ozgur package, and try to save money as there will be a plethora of development paths in the near future with many UAV platforms and wingmen like the Kizilelma and ANCA 3.

The Pakistani commentators I speak to on here, seem to want a 1 to 1 replacement for all their olf J-7s and Mirages that their air force flies, but IMO this is an old way of thinking, in the future you will have network centric warfare with 1 controlling platform(like the KAAN) managing several other autonomous/semi autonomous platforms with sensor fusion.

View attachment 7912

I don't think the early Block 15s will have enough airframe life left in them to be worth upgrading to either V standard (assuming the US even allows it) or the Turkish Ozgur version, maybe the 18 or so Block 52 Vipers, but in any case, it would require US approval for both V and Ozgur upgrades. The J-10CE is essentially a hedge in lieu of upgrading the Vipers.

I think the J-35 will become a multirole platform, and the KAAN the 'high' end air superiority platform. An outlier remains the domestic 'Azm' programme, but in my view this will be scaled down from a heavyweight twin engine platform to a single engine platform with the option of an unmanned version to act as a loyal wingman, if the announcements of collaborating with Turkey are anything to go by. A cheaper single engine NGF type may end up being the backbone to replace the JF-17 in large numbers.

 

[nahtanbob]

Umm.. all the treaty allies are already NSG members unlike India, they didn't need a waiver b/c they didn't have a nuclear weapons program that was outside of the NPT treaty. Why would any of them have needed waivers?

None of the treaty allies minus UK and France have nukes. India has nukes and yet has all the privileges of non-nuclear treaty allies

If India wanted to purchase small number of f-35s without any ToT to address combat aircraft imbalance they will get it. To this point India has not invoked any American offer of F-16, F-15 and F/A-18. It is another way of saying PAF and PLAAF is not a threat.

The list of major weapon systems available to other allies that India has not been offered is a short list
F-35
Patriot PAC-3
Osprey
nuclear propulsion
EMALS

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

So looks like a new PAF in 10 years looking like JF-17C, J-10C, F-16, J-35 and KAAN? Feels like far too many types. Maybe J-10C purchase was. a mistake or interim buy with limited numbers?

KAAN will become available after 2035 when we will start to retire F16s

 

[Oscar]

None of the treaty allies minus UK and France have nukes. India has nukes and yet has all the privileges of non-nuclear treaty allies

If India wanted to purchase small number of f-35s without any ToT to address combat aircraft imbalance they will get it. To this point India has not invoked any American offer of F-16, F-15 and F/A-18. It is another way of saying PAF and PLAAF is not a threat.

The list of major weapon systems available to other allies that India has not been offered is a short list
F-35
Patriot PAC-3
Osprey
nuclear propulsion
EMALS

They sure do keep talking about it