PAF Future Acquisition Plans

[Awan68]

only in hindi movies ....

It never pays to underestimate ur enemy. Hubris is a trait almost always found in the loosing side.

 

[Developereo]

It never pays to underestimate ur enemy. Hubris is a trait almost always found in the loosing side.

The Greeks captured the progression well in Antigone.

arete -> hubris -> ate -> nemesis
excellence -> arrogance -> recklessness -> downfall

 

[FOOLS_NIGHTMARE]

Tejas Mk1A is atleast 2-3 years away from getting fully operational and integrated in IAF.

Meanwhile, PAF just raised 2nd Sqn of much more capabale JF-17C Block-III. Moreover, B-III will shortly participate in a major international aerial exercise along other high tech fighters.

 

[nahtanbob]

The crux of the problem as I see it, is our obsession with using non state actors to keep small fires lit in our neighborhood. Until the start 2000's we were dabbling inside western China with this policy!! This policy or methodology has not panned out positively for Pakistan on any of the borders. Kashmir....now firmly part of Indian Union. Afghanistan a mess that has backfired royally for us. Proxies inside Iran have not delivered if anything was to be delivered. In-fact now it has put GoP in an awkward position. China...well they put a stout piece of wood up our..... and that was the end of that story.

Deploying proxies and supporting them requires a solid long term objective, steadfastness, strong political and public support for the cause, economic and military muscle, and alignment with big power goals in that particular area of operations. Now even with all of this, proxies tend to go their own way when they start exerting influence in their are of operations. US has been at the receiving end of it many a times, and Pakistan too.

Pakistan has none of the above except in one instance, the first Afghan adventure. We should learn from our mistakes and move away from this strategy, it does not work and has not worked for us without the support of the lone superpower. Even China treads with care on this strategy given the myriad complexities in its operations. The nine sisters is a case in point on north east India.

It is high time that we hunker down and look inwards as a nation and do a self check on where we have gone wrong as a nation and what has destroyed our social fabric. Look towards the economy. Don't seek foreign investment but look towards creating and eco system that supports local investment in manufacturing, agri, power distribution and energy and services sectors. There is tons of money that Pakistanis can deploy which they have invested overseas if they feel that its worth their effort and their investments are safeguarded. The trust that was destroyed in the early 70's needs to be restored. This is where entities like SIFC should concentrate. Short term patchwork is not going to work now.

And we certainly need to desist from this proxy game. Hamaray bus ki baat nahee rahee ab ye khel.!!! We have suffered and are suffering.

I still remember when in 2001 one of my acquaintances who used to work for the state department mentioned that when he spoke to a veteran diplomat who had been stationed in New Delhi for a while said that Pakistan should resolve its issues with India on Kashmir soon otherwise India is fast approaching a position in the world pecking order where Pakistan would be threatened with surrendering its side of Kashmir down to Mari!!!

It is high time we took our heads out of our behinds and smell the air.... my apologies for the harsh words and tone.


My 2C worth

This is my two cents.

Creating proxies to operate against Iran, India and China is a losers game for different reasons.

I do not see anything wrong with supporting Islamic variant of the Taliban as long as you can control it and manipulate it. At least you own Afghanistan and you can own Afghanistan to trade with Central Asia. If there is nothing in Central Asia to trade with even the Taliban turns into a losing game. It is utterly embarrassing to support the Taliban for 2 decades and have them turn on their paymasters.

 

[nahtanbob]

Getting it is not an issue, buying at a discounted price is

If you gave PAF a budget of 10 billion dollars you bet they would spend it all on F-16 Indus Vipers

I take it $80 million is the true. price for F-16 I do not know what a discounted price looks for the PAF

 

[Zarvan]

The crux of the problem as I see it, is our obsession with using non state actors to keep small fires lit in our neighborhood. Until the start 2000's we were dabbling inside western China with this policy!! This policy or methodology has not panned out positively for Pakistan on any of the borders. Kashmir....now firmly part of Indian Union. Afghanistan a mess that has backfired royally for us. Proxies inside Iran have not delivered if anything was to be delivered. In-fact now it has put GoP in an awkward position. China...well they put a stout piece of wood up our..... and that was the end of that story.

Deploying proxies and supporting them requires a solid long term objective, steadfastness, strong political and public support for the cause, economic and military muscle, and alignment with big power goals in that particular area of operations. Now even with all of this, proxies tend to go their own way when they start exerting influence in their are of operations. US has been at the receiving end of it many a times, and Pakistan too.

Pakistan has none of the above except in one instance, the first Afghan adventure. We should learn from our mistakes and move away from this strategy, it does not work and has not worked for us without the support of the lone superpower. Even China treads with care on this strategy given the myriad complexities in its operations. The nine sisters is a case in point on north east India.

It is high time that we hunker down and look inwards as a nation and do a self check on where we have gone wrong as a nation and what has destroyed our social fabric. Look towards the economy. Don't seek foreign investment but look towards creating and eco system that supports local investment in manufacturing, agri, power distribution and energy and services sectors. There is tons of money that Pakistanis can deploy which they have invested overseas if they feel that its worth their effort and their investments are safeguarded. The trust that was destroyed in the early 70's needs to be restored. This is where entities like SIFC should concentrate. Short term patchwork is not going to work now.

And we certainly need to desist from this proxy game. Hamaray bus ki baat nahee rahee ab ye khel.!!! We have suffered and are suffering.

I still remember when in 2001 one of my acquaintances who used to work for the state department mentioned that when he spoke to a veteran diplomat who had been stationed in New Delhi for a while said that Pakistan should resolve its issues with India on Kashmir soon otherwise India is fast approaching a position in the world pecking order where Pakistan would be threatened with surrendering its side of Kashmir down to Mari!!!

It is high time we took our heads out of our behinds and smell the air.... my apologies for the harsh words and tone.


My 2C worth

First of our proxy war is going fine. Those fighting is are not even two % of those which we trained in 80s. The kind and number of enemies you have, you actually need proxies and a lot more to do things. You will never be allowed economic power either if you are considered week. You are a only Muslim nation with nukes in middle of most important region so don't expect flowers in return. What we really need to focus on is educational and economic development which can't happen with criminal MAFIAS like PML N and PPP. No offense but you have a surrender mindset which only brings defeat, humiliation and doesn't bring progress or standing in the world.

 

[CSAW]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1751443605305377080

 

[wanglaokan]

My mind still stays in the moment of Imran Khan hosting the J10ce induction ceremony in March 2022, and now J31 is coming to PAF. It's been a while not visiting here.

 

[HRK]

My mind still stays in the moment of Imran Khan hosting the J10ce induction ceremony in March 2022, and now J31 is coming to PAF. It's been a while not visiting here.

Welcome back

 

[wanglaokan]

J-35 which is being tested started form third prototype. The third prototype which was made of J-31 is now being called J-35. So, technology except for landing gear may be will only be different for both. Most will be same.

I think what PAF inducts will be the land version of J35, whatever you name it, be it j31 or other names, it's just be the name of export version randomly picked up by the Pakistani media. I still remember the name unauthorized given by Mr. Rasheed before J10c induction, it's quite funny.

 

[wanglaokan]

After J10ce brings its best performance out against both Rafale and Europe typhoon, PAF will not hesitate a second to go after J35. This time PAF will focus on air domination rather than passively rivaling up enemy threat. and the billions investment on rafale by Indian government will lost its ground. for me J35 deal with Pakistan is more like a strategic move that force our common enemy to the corner.

WS-19 has excellent fuel economy and high reliability, and its push ratio is more than 10, which makes the 3.0 version of "Eagle" in flight, basically eliminate the phenomenon of black smoke from the tail, and meet the requirements of this stealth fighter stealth performance and super cruise.

It shows that China has mastered the technology of dual oil centrifugal nozzles and bipolar vortex technology , and the atomization quality of fuel is good, avoiding the problem of a large number of carbon atoms gathering carbon in the nozzles, basically realizing smokeless combustion in the fuel room, and solving the phenomenon that the smoke concentration of "Eagle" increases and thick black smoke emerges from the tail.

The 3.0 version of "Eagle" not only solves the problem of black smoke from the tail, but also has the technical bonus of WS-19 engine, which improves the maneuverability of the fighter jet during flight, and meets the 3.0 version of "Eagle" with a maximum flight speed of Mach 2.2, a combat radius of 1350 kilometers and a maximum weapon load of 7.8 tons.

In conclusion, WS19 is ready and fully tested for J35. just like they will not induct J10ce if WS10b is not ready.

 

[Zarvan]

I think what PAF inducts will be the land version of J35, whatever you name it, be it j31 or other names, it's just be the name of export version randomly picked up by the Pakistani media. I still remember the name unauthorized given by Mr. Rasheed before J10c induction, it's quite funny.

Sir this time statement has come from our Air Chief and not some minister. This time Air Chief directly mentioned it than PAF released the video in which they confirmed it.

 

[wanglaokan]

Sir this time statement has come from our Air Chief and not some minister. This time Air Chief directly mentioned it than PAF released the video in which they confirmed it.

Dear Zarvan, J31（be it the name of new 5th gen fighter for PAF）might be "Eagle" 3.0 land version. PAF always want the best.
The configuration will be different under the name of J31, depends on the demand by customers and relationship between nations.

 

[Falcon26]

Pakistan hasn’t checkmated its enemies. It is simply lucky to be facing the IAF, which’s a lethargic and inefficient organization. But anyone that follows Indian military developments would know that India is working tirelessly to resolve these issues that plague the Indian Air Force. In time, India will resolve these bottlenecks.

But Pakistan has deep systemic problems both at the social and economic level. With continued stunted economic growth, Pakistan military will not have what it takes to fund big item projects. The ongoing shift to air defense systems is a hint of what’s to come. Pakistan knows it can’t continue to fund procurement of warplanes. It’s why Project Azm was abruptly canceled.

And Pakistan won’t have strong economy without political stability. And political stability can’t happen because the army generals are control freaks that can’t imagine functioning like a normal army. And herein lies Pakistan’s core problem.

 

[Zarvan]

Pakistan hasn’t checkmated its enemies. It is simply lucky to be facing the IAF, which’s a lethargic and inefficient organization. But anyone that follows Indian military developments would know that India is working tirelessly to resolve these issues that plague the Indian Air Force. In time, India will resolve these bottlenecks.

But Pakistan has deep systemic problems both at the social and economic level. With continued stunted economic growth, Pakistan military will not have what it takes to fund big item projects. The ongoing shift to air defense systems is a hint of what’s to come. Pakistan knows it can’t continue to fund procurement of warplanes. It’s why Project Azm was abruptly canceled.

And Pakistan won’t have strong economy without political stability. And political stability can’t happen because the army generals are control freaks that can’t imagine functioning like a normal army. And herein lies Pakistan’s core problem.

India is nowhere close to resolving these bottle necks. These bottlenecks will take at least 15 more years to resolve. That too if everything falls in best case scenario. Yes, we have Economic issues which we need to resolve also social problems. But no offense the social problems India is facing, and they are making them worse and getting even more worse.