Pakistan’s push to replace legacy aircraft

[Justin TruDont]

More J-10C and more J-10C needed.

That's logical for a High low mix

J10C number should eventually exceed your F16 fleet size

You will eventually need to find replacement for F16s as well
Considering the fact that Barring 18 odd block 52 , rest of your fleet is from the 1980s

 

[Justin TruDont]

Yes and J 10 final number won't be less than 100. How many BLOCK III we would induct that is the question and what is JF 17 PFX.

I believe original plan for Jf17 was to induct 250 units
With this aircraft Replacing your entire Mirage 3/5 and F7 fleet

will increase in J10C number eat into the Planned Jf17 fleet size

 

[Fatman17]

That's logical for a High low mix

J10C number should eventually exceed your F16 fleet size

You will eventually need to find replacement for F16s as well
Considering the fact that Barring 18 odd block 52 , rest of your fleet is from the 1980s

Upgraded to AM BM Block 40 standard. Still useful.

 

[Justin TruDont]

Upgraded to AM BM Block 40 standard. Still useful.

Even the Mirage 2000v5 and Mig29UPG of IAF are still considered useful , infact the Mig29s are getting a second engine upgrade

But we cannot deny that each airframe has limited service life

When India Retires mig29s and Mirage 2000 starting 2034 , will PAF still fly the older F16s for another decade beyond 2035

 

[Fatman17]

Even the Mirage 2000v5 and Mig29UPG of IAF are still considered useful , infact the Mig29s are getting a second engine upgrade

But we cannot deny that each airframe has limited service life

When India Retires mig29s and Mirage 2000 starting 2034 , will PAF still fly the older F16s for another decade beyond 2035

Possibility is there. Remember Taiwan just had their A and B upgraded to the V configuration. So nowadays anything is possible.

 

[Yasser76]

With a V upgrade PAF can fly out the Viper till 2040, in fact even USAF plan to do this, we could also try and get some new build Vs we could have 100 F-16s out till 2040, so PAF could be

100 F-16
100 J-10C
100 J-31
100 JF-17 Block III

 

[Zephyrus]

What about tankers, Cargo and other supporting platforms?

 

[Fatman17]

With a V upgrade PAF can fly out the Viper till 2040, in fact even USAF plan to do this, we could also try and get some new build Vs we could have 100 F-16s out till 2040, so PAF could be

100 F-16
100 J-10C
100 J-31
100 JF-17 Block III

Optimistic scenario but not impossible

 

[Yasser76]

What about tankers, Cargo and other supporting platforms?

I do not think they are ever included in the 400 aircraft number ACM mentioned, as it is just fighters, but you are spot on here, there seems little conversation about supporting assets

Erieye is here to stay for a long time, I even think we have upgraded to ER versions

Falcon 20 EW needs urgent replacing, very old airframes

IL-76 Tankers, although not old PAF are finding these hard to maintain and guzzle a lot of fuel

CN-235 on way out

C-130 by 2030 these will be way too old, we rejected J version

SAAB 2000 will be kept airframes are new and supports Erieye training, also does same light transport job that CN-235 can do

Possibly I think PAF, if funds permit can go for

20 C-390/KC390 (12 transport, 8 air refuelling) to replace all C-130s and IL-176
3 Global Express EW jets with Turkish EW equipment to replace Falcons

 

[Fatman17]

I do not think they are ever included in the 400 aircraft number ACM mentioned, as it is just fighters, but you are spot on here, there seems little conversation about supporting assets

Erieye is here to stay for a long time, I even think we have upgraded to ER versions

Falcon 20 EW needs urgent replacing, very old airframes

IL-76 Tankers, although not old PAF are finding these hard to maintain and guzzle a lot of fuel

CN-235 on way out

C-130 by 2030 these will be way too old, we rejected J version

SAAB 2000 will be kept airframes are new and supports Erieye training, also does same light transport job that CN-235 can do

Possibly I think PAF, if funds permit can go for

20 C-390/KC390 (12 transport, 8 air refuelling) to replace all C-130s and IL-176
3 Global Express EW jets with Turkish EW equipment to replace Falcons

Buying new aircraft is unfortunately not possible or feasible. Most likely PAF will continue to scour the market for used aircraft which will be upgraded to its requirements.

 

[arslank01]

Falcon 20 EW needs urgent replacing, very old airframes

sidhu already confirmed the first global airframe will be converted by TAI to HavaSoj.

 

[harpy1]

Unsure why you jumped in here, this if a PAF Modernisation thread, do you not get enough attention on the IAF threads?

I will refrain from mentioning IAF

But your list although very impressive is a bit fantasy.

Kaan has working prototype decade of development ahead of it and Turkey needs numbers to replace F16 ..I read an article recently they expect unit cost to exceed 100 Million and production to be slow initially
You may need to add decade to 2035 if PAF ever finds the money and Turkey then production rate..

The J31 will come imo but again in smaller no's imo why because fifth generation fighters are triple cost to fly per hour ...it's hard to maintain large fleet

Finally j10 is the one plane I think will grow in numbers from 20 ordered to more because I think PAF will need real replacement for USA F16 and answer to Rafale and upgraded mki and Tejas threat which will grow this coming decade

Will you induct 250 fighters in decade
I bet you struggle to induct half that number ...just based on past performance of your inductions and the finances

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

By inducting KIZILELMA (air superiority) and ANKA-3 (deep penetration and strike) type AI enabled stand-alone stealthy combat unmanned jets (with all the amenities a manned fighter can carry), which can be continuously upgraded to cater for technological innovations, the PAF can offset the IAF procurements in a cost effective manner. Since they require no constant pilot training they're damn cheap to maintain and operate. Moreover, the PAC can do local production with active participation in the R&D.....

According to Elon Mask, the unmanned combat jet is the future. And, Selchuk Bayrkatar has said he has the technological and fiscal spaces to pitch 10 KEs against a single Greek F-35....

*A twin engine version of KE is being developed for supersonic flight regimes.

 

[Yasser76]

I will refrain from mentioning IAF

But your list although very impressive is a bit fantasy.

Kaan has working prototype decade of development ahead of it and Turkey needs numbers to replace F16 ..I read an article recently they expect unit cost to exceed 100 Million and production to be slow initially
You may need to add decade to 2035 if PAF ever finds the money and Turkey then production rate..

The J31 will come imo but again in smaller no's imo why because fifth generation fighters are triple cost to fly per hour ...it's hard to maintain large fleet

Finally j10 is the one plane I think will grow in numbers from 20 ordered to more because I think PAF will need real replacement for USA F16 and answer to Rafale and upgraded mki and Tejas threat which will grow this coming decade

Will you induct 250 fighters in decade
I bet you struggle to induct half that number ...just based on past performance of your inductions and the finances

If it fantasy why not leave the thread and let us discuss?

 

[harpy1]

If it fantasy why not leave the thread and let us discuss?

I am.now sir