Pakistan’s push to replace legacy aircraft

[Hussain]

I’m just glad we got rid of the flying pipe.

F7?

 

[Yasser76]

By inducting KIZILELMA (air superiority) and ANKA-3 (deep penetration and strike) type AI enabled stand-alone stealthy combat unmanned jets (with all the amenities a manned fighter can carry), which can be continuously upgraded to cater for technological innovations, the PAF can offset the IAF procurements in a cost effective manner. Since they require no constant pilot training they're damn cheap to maintain and operate. Moreover, the PAC can do local production with active participation in the R&D.....

According to Elon Mask, the unmanned combat jet is the future. And, Selchuk Bayrkatar has said he has the technological and fiscal spaces to pitch 10 KEs against a single Greek F-35....

*A twin engine version of KE is being developed for supersonic flight regimes.

Yes, certainly seems there may be a strategy of buying a lot of relatively cheap drones from China and Turkey and swamping IAF air defences during the outbreak of a war, if we can turn Akinci and Wing Look into some sort of SEAD Drone that may get the IAF to start shooting and wasting plenty of S-400s....

 

[Qureshi]

PAF would probably consist on following (UAVs not included).

Post 2025 - 30

200 -JF17s (I/II/III) BLK I & II will get upgrade to III standards
54~60 - J10Cs
74 - F16s (MLU-ed & BLK52)
36~40 - L15Bs
36~40 - Mirage (ROSE III)

22 Sqds 4-4.5 gen aircrafts (BVR capable)


Post 2030 - 35

200 -JF17s (I/II/III)
72~80 - J10Cs
74 - F16s (MLU-ed & BLK52) If upgraded to "V" or otherwise only BLK 52
36~40 - L15Bs
18 - J31s
10~12 - KAAN (subject to Indigenized engine)

22-24 Sqds 4.5 - 5 gen aircrafts


NP: BLK-I/II of JF17 would not be phase out, considering the funds, time & resources exerted in this project.

 

[MasterChief]

With a V upgrade PAF can fly out the Viper till 2040, in fact even USAF plan to do this, we could also try and get some new build Vs we could have 100 F-16s out till 2040, so PAF could be

100 F-16
100 J-10C
100 J-31
100 JF-17 Block III

Only possible with so called denuclearization. No more F16s for anything less. They won't give us F16s even if they are given drone bases etc. Gone are the days.

 

[Zarvan]

What about tankers, Cargo and other supporting platforms?

400 fighter jets. Rest will be separate. AWACS are already in large numbers. For Tankers it would be YY 20 of China and EW will be I think from Turkey. Few other platforms as well.

 

[CynicalPakistaniCritic]

The JF-17 PFX really needs to be centered around the best engine Pakistan can get for it in its weight class. Hopefully the WS-19 will be ready soon, because the engine specs aren’t that much different from the original YF-16 F100-PW-200 specs.

The PAF needs the JF-17 to be, they way Sweden uses its Gripen E, their everything fighter. The J-10 and F-16 can be the top of the spear but the bulk of the fleet needs to be almost right up their with these birds in all but weight of weapons carried and size of their radars.

There is a new engine for the JF-17 Block 3, I think WS-13E

I think it was confirmed if anyone can shed some light @Oscar @Deino

 

[Ak01]

There is a new engine for the JF-17 Block 3, I think WS-13E

I think it was confirmed if anyone can shed some light @Oscar @Deino

nope

 

[Oscar]

There is a new engine for the JF-17 Block 3, I think WS-13E

I think it was confirmed if anyone can shed some light @Oscar @Deino

No

And

It is all hyperbole at this point - the amount of cross pollination of rumors and speculation from here to X to other forums and back here on topics leads to a whole lot of junk roaming around in orbit bringing good discussions down like the space junk did for poor Sandra Bullocks time on the ISS.

 

[alphapak]

Only possible with so called denuclearization. No more F16s for anything less. They won't give us F16s even if they are given drone bases etc. Gone are the days.

Some people still can't get over their F16 fetish, even though PAF has moved on
to J10C.

 

[m52k85]

New engine story needs to be seen in back-drop of Russian invasion. Here is a likely scenario: Pre-2022, contract for Rd-93MA agreed with Russia, first few engines delivered for initial 14 to 18 Block 3s (this coincides with the 2021 and 2022 production at PAC), Russia unable to deliver remaining engines, Chinese engine only viable remaining option, used to complete last 12 or so Block 3s. This would make Alan's published claims about the new 'flying' block 3s having the 'MA' engine true. It would also make the retired Sq Leaders comment on video standing infront of the block 3 in Duabai, true.

Twitter rumours neither add or remove anything from the above chain of events.

It might actually be a blessing in disguise, like so many other problems PAF has faced over the years. If rumours be true, the chinese engine is a higher by-pass engine, that should give Batch B greater endurance and range, while Batch A would have relatively better air superiority performance (time to altitude etc).

 

[Ak01]

Some people still can't get over their F16 fetish, even though PAF has moved on
to J10C.

yes, for good reason.

The F-16 is arguably the perfect aircraft for the PAF, the PAF knows this too which is why they continued to keep chasing it. I bet you now, if it became available again, they would pursue it again.

 

[alphapak]

The F-16 is arguably the perfect aircraft for the PAF, the PAF knows this too which is why they continued to keep chasing it. I bet you now, if it became available again, they would pursue it again.

I agree it would be perfect if they had no strings attached. What is the
guarantee that they become available, PAF makes payment and then they
are blocked again. There was a time when PAF made payment and got soya
bean oil instead.

 

[Ak01]

I agree it would be perfect if they had no strings attached. What is the
guarantee that they become available, PAF makes payment and then they
are blocked again. There was a time when PAF made payment and got soya
bean oil instead.

Every arms purchase has strings attached, you need to get this. The only reason its been more evident with the US is the fact that the US actually has influence. China is up and coming, they know arms=influence, getting arms in the hands of their allies and then using them to twist their arm is a natural progression.

There was a time when PAF made payment and got soya
bean oil instead.

this was an agreement between both, that 30% of the value of the money would be paid back in food/commodities.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

I believe original plan for Jf17 was to induct 250 units
With this aircraft Replacing your entire Mirage 3/5 and F7 fleet

will increase in J10C number eat into the Planned Jf17 fleet size

Original plan was between 150-250 but then Dawn of the Drones started.

 

[firohot]

Aircraft	Quantity
JF-17 Thunders	149
J-10C Indus Dragon	20
F-16 Falcon	74
J-31 Gyrfalcon
L-15 (LIFT)

So, Pakistan Air Force intends acquire a total of 157 fighter aircraft consisting Thunders, Indus Dragons, Gyrfalcons and L-15s by 2030 at the latest.

Why do we need l15 read on pdf that jf17 twin seater be used for lift