Iranian Air Force (IRIAF/IRGC-ASF) | News and Discussions

[Immortals]

Adquiring/manufacturing, testing and certifying all this avionics and engines in those old airframes are probably much more costly than just adquiring any new aircraft. So don´t pay too much attention in this.

Not only that, but F-14 with a swept back wing design was a maintenance heavy machine. It used to cost the the American $20-30K/hour (in 1990’s dollars!!)

Also F-14 has an RCS of a blimp, so it doesn’t make sense building a 25m2+ fighter jet these days. It’s a beast from a different.

Lastly keeping this Frankenstein hodge posse of fighters afloat (american, Russian, Chinese, and French fighters) is not cheap. I hope people know that.

The maintenance on F-14 is likely very expensive each year and eats a large part of the [nonexistent] airforce budget.

I still believe (like I have for years) that Iran is building a fighter jet engine for a medium size fighter. There was enough leaks and insights from engineers who have come and gone to believe it still exist.

The million dollar question is will the government fund such a massive project that is likely going to be in scope similar to what Bavar 373 was for Iran if not more.

Bavar 373 was an easy decision for Iran. Shiny toy planes….not so much.

 

[Emirzad]

View attachment 60136

Developing a fighter whose fuselage is 50 years old is a bad investment, especially since Iran does not have the ability to extend the life of the fuselage in a real way. Iran had the opportunity within 40 years to reproduce the F-4 aircraft after developing and redesigning it with the help of China or to produce the design of the F-14 aircraft by reverse engineering with the help of China, but it did not want to do that at all or even buy a project from China or Russia, so it began developing it within what it did in Pakistan with the JF-17 aircraft, but Pakistan allocates all its desires for the JF-17 aircraft to match the performance of the Swedish JAS-39E aircraft, but Pakistan provides the minimum defensive capability with a local product with imports from China for other aircraft. Iran relies on ballistic missiles and drones, but this is not enough. Countries have integrated systems and do not rely on only one weapon, and the effectiveness of ballistic missiles in traditional Russia is limited in its destructive capacity, so countries like the Kurtin develop their ballistic missiles with destructive warheads weighing 2.5-4.5 tons because the Russians' destructive effectiveness of 500-1000 kilograms is limited and may in some cases be ineffective for large targets, and Iran cares about range at the expense of destructive capacity.

View attachment 60137

IRIAF has never been interested in having a local F-4E/D derivative. They should have been in the 80s/90s, considering the BAE interests in it which some on the aviation circuit believe led to the EF-2000 design. Not sure if its true or not. They did get the plane heavily upgraded for naval strike with range of local SOWs, new radars etc though. Same goes for F-14A/AM. In modern battlefields because of HUGE RCS an F-4 or F-14 will be tracked and attacked/thwarted with long range BVR/AD weapons from distance. Its utility in modern air as a long range interceptor is next to none unless it undergoes a heavy upgradation program with local AESA radar, Datalinking, ARH BVR/Imaging HOBS WVR slaved to IRST and HMD. Also It should launch an ALBM weapon in MIG-31BM like role. IRIAF's budget does not allow that otherwise such a force of 40-50 fighters can be a pain for the enemy.

The only fighter design and by that I mean aerodynamics that Iran has ever played around with was F-5E/F because of Ti Alloy issue and also the fact that J-85II turbojets were somewhat locally manufacturable (with black market components). There is another issue, the plane's design was loved by the only actual visionary commander of IRIAF post the 80s war i.e. Mansour Sattari who came from the Air-defense division. He saw its low RCS design, easy to build frame combined with Shahi/US interests in this family of fighters that led to F-20, YF-17, F-18A/E/F so under him the projects of local F-5E/F derivatives started in 90s. For that time it was a good prospect to create a local force of nimble CAP fighters with local 4th-generation avionics. Kowsar was his vision as "Azarakhsh-II" which if he had been alive would have come into service in mid mid-2000s. A F-20/FCK-1 equivalent. With RD-33 in it which Iran did ask for, it would have become a JAS-39. No one can doubt the Iranian electronics industry, people have seen our radars, comms, jammers, sats, AD etc in battle, we are top-notch in that area, problem was a lack of commitment towards having an airforce post-Sattari.

The issue is not the expertise, it's the politically appointed fraud commanders and ministers we started getting, who lied through their teeth to the leadership about meaningless achievements in combat aviation. Saeghe testbed did not produce the aerodynamic performance but a squadron of 6 testbeds were "inducted" in front of Clergy leaders. Depot-level maintenance programs were shown as "upgrades". I would not trust these clowns with SU-35S unless IRGC takes over IRIAF.

 

[Oscar]

The issue is not the expertise, it's the politically appointed fraud commanders and ministers we started getting, who lied through their teeth to the leadership about meaningless achievements in combat aviation. Saeghe testbed did not produce the aerodynamic performance but a squadron of 6 testbeds were "inducted" in front of Clergy leaders. Depot-level maintenance programs were shown as "upgrades". I would not trust these clowns with SU-35S unless IRGC takes over IRIAF.

Oddly enough when I mentioned this a while back and other propaganda level achievements I was jumped on by the mob

Iran had a golden opportunity to invest in excellent step projects including the Shafaq which could have provided the basis for more advanced projects but at the end since Ahmedinijad came in the focus has been these over hyper assymetric projects or frankly the “pioneer radio” school project type situations like the Qaher.

The way the UAV division and potentially the SAM development has advanced seems to have not translated at all to the manned aircraft division.

 

[Emirzad]

Oddly enough when I mentioned this a while back and other propaganda level achievements I was jumped on by the mob

Iran had a golden opportunity to invest in excellent step projects including the Shafaq which could have provided the basis for more advanced projects but at the end since Ahmedinijad came in the focus has been these over hyper assymetric projects or frankly the “pioneer radio” school project type situations like the Qaher.

The way the UAV division and potentially the SAM development has advanced seems to have not translated at all to the manned aircraft division.

The manned Combat Aviation sector in Iran is the worst in almost all defence branches. The irony is that while other branches such as Missiles both BM/CM, Airdefence, UCAVs, radars, SLVs, etc and even navy was making strides the combat aviation sector was regressing.

While the situation seems bleak it is not that worst either. IRIAF despite all this mismanagement has produced some very commendable results over the years:

1) Without foriegn power's help or collaboration, the fighter fleet kept on going. Complicated platforms like F-14A or MIG-29 are not easy to keep airborne without the help of their manufacturers but through a large and robust local industry, the system kept going. Even if the black market option was used sometimes then its still praiseworthy. In the case of few platforms, the local upgradation programs translated into enhanced capabilities as well e.g. the upgraded F-4E/D "Dowran" squadrons can sink any conventional navy's surface fleet with their ALCM+PGM attacks in combination with IRGC's AShCM/AShBM/UCAV packages. Upgraded F-14AM's can thwart even an F-15 from 150 KM away using local BVRs "Fakour", the same plane can launch a mean imaging all aspect WVR weapon with HOBS matching R-73. Locally built Kowsar can become part of the UCAV fleet and IADS of radars/SAM batteries through datalinking etc. IRGC's SU-22M4 can launch ALBMs while taking target cues through datalinks. Its not much but it is not nothing.

2) The capability to design and induct has been demonstrated in case of local PGMs, long-range ARH/SARH BVR, local imaging all aspect WVR, modern airborne Fire Control Radars, avionics, local ECM/ECCM packages, flight computers, local turbojets etc

3) All the required ingredients are there, its just the will of the leadership to put in money and good managers (may be from IRGC) the same way they did for Aeropsace, naval etc sectors. Once we get going in combat aviation sector, IRIAF will become in combat aviation what IRGC's aerospace force is in missile power.

 

[Piet]

Iran as a country, does not have the political will or devotion to maintain a proper airforce otherwise if we go by pure technical capability, Iran can produce a better version of every single component for such an upgrade, except for the turbofan, even that is possible with mild level collaboration.

Weak, immature, and nonserious leadership has ruined the following programs with a lack of budget (400-600 mln for IRIAF) and political appointments such as incompetent Vahedi.

-Kowsar, a light 4.0 Generation CAP+interceptor, 5 produced in 6 years. Realistically the program should have concluded by 2025 with 70 initially planned fighters, with small RCS, long tracking range radar, FBW, avionics, a light BVR/All-aspect WVR, data linking, etc. A hard to defeat fleet inside IADS that data linked with UCAVs+LORADS/SHORADS would have produced a nimble layer of air defense. This would have allowed IADS and other interceptors to breathe but no $$$ put in = the program is dead. This fleet would have been a perfect complement to the incoming Su-35S.

- Yasin-AFT, still flying on non-afterburning J-85/Owj, 2 produced of which one is flyable now. Its lack of induction tells us the Kowsar program is dead just like before it, SaegheI/II died with 6 abominations. Yasin AFT uses the same modern avionics package as Kowsar so if Yasin is not being produced or inducted then it means Kowsar, any local F-4/14 upgrade plan has died as well. SAIRAN produced avionics for 4.0 to 4+ generation fighters that we have seen in unveilings have gone to waste.

- F-14AM upgrade could have given Iran a long-range BVR interceptor to thwart IAF's large RCS attack fighters such as F-15I over Iraq or Saudi Airspace, but barely 15-18 aircrafts underwent depot level upgrade, rest of the fleet (42 airframes in total) is not even seen anymore on CAP or parades let alone on QRA/FMC duties. IAF fighters can easily deploy ALBMs over Iraq, nothing is there to thwart them. They can easily come deep into Iraqi airspace, deliver lofted Apogee ALBMs on Bavar/S-300PMu2/Khordad/OTH sites, and return. Once the IADS is injured, the tactical and dare I say strategic sites can be taken out. Maghsoud LRBVR is not delivered to F-14AM fleet so this tells us the fleet may retire. LR-BVR thwarts enemy missions esp the ones that need the enemy attack aircraft to come into a predictable zone with known speed, altitude etc. Such is how ALBM is launched. Not to mention the huge RCS of ALBM carrying aircraft. Israel will not risk losing fighters over Iraq so suddenly the equation changes but leadership is focused on hanging 15 year old girls.

- MIG-29 9.12 lacks ARH BVR, its radar is barely tracking a 4th-generation fighter at 50 KM. It has no SAR or ECCM package. F-4E/D Dowran still lacks BVR and modern HOBS WVR. Why they are still flying Mirages, F-7, F-5 crap? Just recently some stupid commander of a base hosting Mirages was talking about "Habibi Upgrade" of using Fakours SARH and SAIRAN radar/avionics package on Mirages, a project which may cost 200 mln USD to bring 2 squadrons to life. but in reality, Mirages lack pylons.

- Azarakhsh WVR is being shown as SAM but is not deployed on IRIAF aircraft. It's an all-aspect high HOBS weapon with a Contrast Imaging seeker but IRIAF still uses Shahi AIM-9J (non-all aspect) with deformed paint. Local AIM-7M equivalent "Arash-Light BVR" was shown twice but like Maghsood it's gone too.

....... List goes on. IRIAF needs to be given to IRGC-AF otherwise the branch is done. IRGC will turn IRIAF into

<Apologies for my previous incomplete post>

Greetings



It is really concerning that 70 Kowsar's were scheduled to be completed by 2025, but nada. These fighters operating under Iranian IADS-cover would certainly have been a force to reckon with. I am not talking about head-on dust-ups, but the mere presence of these fighters exercising constraints on the enemies planning.

Yasin has a very progressive cockpit layout. I would venture to say equal to more progressive than Kowsar. So more the pity.

F-14AM. Missiles cannot replace everything. I remember in the mid-60's down here all the talk was of missiles replacing combat a/c, especially in the attack role. If SU-35 and/or SU-30XX can be had by Iran, this would give it the capability of launching heavier ALBM's.

As I posted to another forum, if fighters really were passe, then why are countries around the world buying such as if there's a fire sale going on.

Why put up aircraft - and trained pilots - in MIG-29 9.12 and F-4E/D Dowran jalopies - that are only going to be so much target practice for modern opposing combat a/c?

Azarakhsh WVR being shown as a SAM but not deployed on IRIAF aircraft? ... . Makes no *sense* whatsoever. To my point of interest in particular, why are inclusive Arash BVR and specialist Maghsoud LR BVR missile's treated like a relative in jail? You still love him but you just don't speak of him. Fakours on a Mirage F-1? Hmm.


Returning to lightweight BVR missiles, why do Iran not take a page out of Pakistan’s GIDS’ playbook with its BVR FAAZ – RF and - IR missiles?



I have also posted some time back on PDF that I thought that a change of the guard at IRIAF to IRGC could only be beneficial



Piet

 

[Emirzad]

It is really concerning that 70 Kowsar's were scheduled to be completed by 2025, but nada. These fighters operating under Iranian IADS-cover would certainly have been a force to reckon with. I am not talking about head-on dust-ups, but the mere presence of these fighters exercising constraints on the enemies planning.

Yasin has a very progressive cockpit layout. I would venture to say equal to more progressive than Kowsar. So more the pity.

F-14AM. Missiles cannot replace everything. I remember in the mid-60's down here all the talk was of missiles replacing combat a/c, especially in the attack role. If SU-35 and/or SU-30XX can be had by Iran, this would give it the capability of launching heavier ALBM's.

As I posted to another forum, if fighters really were passe, then why are countries around the world buying such as if there's a fire sale going on.

Why put up aircraft - and trained pilots - in MIG-29 9.12 and F-4E/D Dowran jalopies - that are only going to be so much target practice for modern opposing combat a/c?

Azarakhsh WVR being shown as a SAM but not deployed on IRIAF aircraft? ... . Makes no *sense* whatsoever. To my point of interest in particular, why are inclusive Arash BVR and specialist Maghsoud LR BVR missile's treated like a relative in jail? You still love him but you just don't speak of him. Fakours on a Mirage F-1? Hmm.


Returning to lightweight BVR missiles, why do Iran not take a page out of Pakistan’s GIDS’ playbook with its BVR FAAZ – RF and - IR missiles?



I have also posted some time back on PDF that I thought that a change of the guard at IRIAF to IRGC could only be beneficial

Problems with IRIAF in last 15-20 years are not the lack of Indigenous capability but it is the lack of money and commitment by leadership who were very interested in missiles, UCAVS, air-defense but not manned combat aviation.

- Kowsar/Azarakhsh-II is a thing of 2000s. An FCK-1 or F-20 type light fighter with strong avionics would have been good for 2000s-2010s if produced in targeted numbers but budget cuts ruined the program. I have already explained how lack of Yasin's induction (Kowsar's AT) points to Kowsar program finally biting the dust due to lack of $$$. 5 planes are flying, my guess is that they will show 1 odd squadron some years later and call it "Induction" like with Saeghe testbeds.

- Not sure what you are implying with F-14AM. I think the fleet is done considering the ratio of FMC airframes (~20)/number of available airframes (42 atleast). Maghsoud was supposed to be the ultimate ARH ECCM BVR for it with a thwarting range above 200+ KM but it vanished from exhibitions while Azarakhsh missile which was supposed to be a modern imaging All-aspect/HOBS WVR for F-14AM (like AIM-9X) is now a SAM. This tells us the lack of future for Tomcat fleet. Its hard to maintain old plane with HUGE RCS problem so it makes sense, but with cats gone and no SU-35+R-37 as of yet the long-range interception game is lost already. IAF can come close to the Iranian border to volley lofted ALBMs with no challenge, similarly Persian Gulf theatre is now the job of IADS with minimal IRIAF help.

- F-4E/D Dowran fleet is dedicated to maritime and land strikes, they have no A2A role assigned to them. The upgraded platform was supposed to have new A2A weaponry considering its new pulse Doppler radar by SAIRAN "Bayenaat-1" can track targets at 100+ KM (150 KM search range).

- MIG-29 9.12 without upgrade is a point defender at best. The plane has no ECM/ECCM, its relic N019 Sapfir 29 radar (derived from MIG-23ML) will be jammed from a distance and without datalinking its a sitting duck against modern fighters. Mind you the Iranian MIG fleet has never received even an ounce of avionics upgrade compared to AWG-9 of F-14A which was attempted to bring to APG-71 standard.

 

[Piet]

Problems with IRIAF in last 15-20 years are not the lack of Indigenous capability but it is the lack of money and commitment by leadership who were very interested in missiles, UCAVS, air-defense but not manned combat aviation.

- Kowsar/Azarakhsh-II is a thing of 2000s. An FCK-1 or F-20 type light fighter with strong avionics would have been good for 2000s-2010s if produced in targeted numbers but budget cuts ruined the program. I have already explained how lack of Yasin's induction (Kowsar's AT) points to Kowsar program finally biting the dust due to lack of $$$. 5 planes are flying, my guess is that they will show 1 odd squadron some years later and call it "Induction" like with Saeghe testbeds.

- Not sure what you are implying with F-14AM. I think the fleet is done considering the ratio of FMC airframes (~20)/number of available airframes (42 atleast). Maghsoud was supposed to be the ultimate ARH ECCM BVR for it with a thwarting range above 200+ KM but it vanished from exhibitions while Azarakhsh missile which was supposed to be a modern imaging All-aspect/HOBS WVR for F-14AM (like AIM-9X) is now a SAM. This tells us the lack of future for Tomcat fleet. Its hard to maintain old plane with HUGE RCS problem so it makes sense, but with cats gone and no SU-35+R-37 as of yet the long-range interception game is lost already. IAF can come close to the Iranian border to volley lofted ALBMs with no challenge, similarly Persian Gulf theatre is now the job of IADS with minimal IRIAF help.
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- F-4E/D Dowran fleet is dedicated to maritime and land strikes, they have no A2A role assigned to them. The upgraded platform was supposed to have new A2A weaponry considering its new pulse Doppler radar by SAIRAN "Bayenaat-1" can track targets at 100+ KM (150 KM search range).

- MIG-29 9.12 without upgrade is a point defender at best. The plane has no ECM/ECCM, its relic N019 Sapfir 29 radar (derived from MIG-23ML) will be jammed from a distance and without datalinking its a sitting duck against modern fighters. Mind you the Iranian MIG fleet has never received even an ounce of avionics upgrade compared to AWG-9 of F-14A which was attempted to bring to APG-71 standard.

View attachment 60136

Developing a fighter whose fuselage is 50 years old is a bad investment, especially since Iran does not have the ability to extend the life of the fuselage in a real way. Iran had the opportunity within 40 years to reproduce the F-4 aircraft after developing and redesigning it with the help of China or to produce the design of the F-14 aircraft by reverse engineering with the help of China, but it did not want to do that at all or even buy a project from China or Russia, so it began developing it within what it did in Pakistan with the JF-17 aircraft, but Pakistan allocates all its desires for the JF-17 aircraft to match the performance of the Swedish JAS-39E aircraft, but Pakistan provides the minimum defensive capability with a local product with imports from China for other aircraft. Iran relies on ballistic missiles and drones, but this is not enough. Countries have integrated systems and do not rely on only one weapon, and the effectiveness of ballistic missiles in traditional Russia is limited in its destructive capacity, so countries like the Kurtin develop their ballistic missiles with destructive warheads weighing 2.5-4.5 tons because the Russians' destructive effectiveness of 500-1000 kilograms is limited and may in some cases be ineffective for large targets, and Iran cares about range at the expense of destructive capacity.

View attachment 60137

Nice.

Piet

 

[Immortals]

Problems with IRIAF in last 15-20 years are not the lack of Indigenous capability but it is the lack of money and commitment by leadership who were very interested in missiles, UCAVS, air-defense but not manned combat aviation.

- Kowsar/Azarakhsh-II is a thing of 2000s. An FCK-1 or F-20 type light fighter with strong avionics would have been good for 2000s-2010s if produced in targeted numbers but budget cuts ruined the program. I have already explained how lack of Yasin's induction (Kowsar's AT) points to Kowsar program finally biting the dust due to lack of $$$. 5 planes are flying, my guess is that they will show 1 odd squadron some years later and call it "Induction" like with Saeghe testbeds.

- Not sure what you are implying with F-14AM. I think the fleet is done considering the ratio of FMC airframes (~20)/number of available airframes (42 atleast). Maghsoud was supposed to be the ultimate ARH ECCM BVR for it with a thwarting range above 200+ KM but it vanished from exhibitions while Azarakhsh missile which was supposed to be a modern imaging All-aspect/HOBS WVR for F-14AM (like AIM-9X) is now a SAM. This tells us the lack of future for Tomcat fleet. Its hard to maintain old plane with HUGE RCS problem so it makes sense, but with cats gone and no SU-35+R-37 as of yet the long-range interception game is lost already. IAF can come close to the Iranian border to volley lofted ALBMs with no challenge, similarly Persian Gulf theatre is now the job of IADS with minimal IRIAF help.

- F-4E/D Dowran fleet is dedicated to maritime and land strikes, they have no A2A role assigned to them. The upgraded platform was supposed to have new A2A weaponry considering its new pulse Doppler radar by SAIRAN "Bayenaat-1" can track targets at 100+ KM (150 KM search range).

- MIG-29 9.12 without upgrade is a point defender at best. The plane has no ECM/ECCM, its relic N019 Sapfir 29 radar (derived from MIG-23ML) will be jammed from a distance and without datalinking its a sitting duck against modern fighters. Mind you the Iranian MIG fleet has never received even an ounce of avionics upgrade compared to AWG-9 of F-14A which was attempted to bring to APG-71 standard.

Solid analysis. Can’t say I disagree.

And the lack of SU-35 and recycled news of the commander talking about building a “heavy fighter” and engine is concerning since they announced this same type of news many times in last 5-7 years so by now they should have been at a prototype stage.

Still holding out hope that they didn’t scrap the domestic fighter and engine project as well. But you never know with this anti AF mentality this government has that extends to the days of post Shah era.

 

[Mr Iran Eye]

Dr. Mason is still talking nonsense full of speculation. The guy who went to the Wikipedia page that has been stagnating for years to say the number of Kowsars built. The famous lack of money of the IRIAF is completely false, they are speculating because for me it is the opposite.

The IRIAF showed 3 assembly lines of the Kowsar, they are working to manufacture weapons for this plane. We saw an engine assembly line, we saw a new radar. The Kowsar is still evolving. Same for the Yasin, Qaher-313. Plus the improvements of the F-4, Mig-29, F-14 and more.

A lot of things are happening behind the scenes, the IRIAF is well funded and they are making a lot of progress. I will end up being right about people here who do not know how to think and observe. The rest will be exciting and revealing.

 

[Emirzad]

Solid analysis. Can’t say I disagree.

And the lack of SU-35 and recycled news of the commander talking about building a “heavy fighter” and engine is concerning since they announced this same type of news many times in last 5-7 years so by now they should have been at a prototype stage.

Still holding out hope that they didn’t scrap the domestic fighter and engine project as well. But you never know with this anti AF mentality this government has that extends to the days of post Shah era.

YAK-131 induction/operationalization before Yasin AT atleast points to inbound SU-35S fleet. If they come with Khibiny ECM pods, R-37M, HMD-Slaved R-73M, full integration with IADS through novel Datalink then long-range interceptions over the Persian Gulf and Iraqi airspace can still be carried out on the periphery of IADS. The numbers should be higher though, a circus fleet of 2 squadrons will not cut it considering the Cat fleet is gonna retire. Flanker airframes still have a huge RCS and there is zero local infrastructure inside Iran to maintain the Russian untouchable.

Foriegn procurement will not solve the inherent problem IRIAF has though. If leadership gets serious like how they did with Missiles, SLVs, UCAVs, Navy, Airdefence, etc the local industry can rebirth a new IRIAF from the ashes of the current shit show force. If they just re-vitalize the current 4th generation fleet with heavy local upgradations + foriegn procurements then Iran gets a force enough to scare the enemy that any attack on Iran will be thwarted/unsuccessful and will give IRGC-AF time to respond in kind with BM/CM/Swarm drones. Considering what kind of damage IRGC can inflict this will become a dangerous situation for the enemy atleast regionally.

There needs to be a budget of atleast 12-15 Bln USD, but do we seriously think that battle hardened ground soldiers turned fake strategists like Salami, Bagheri etc even understand this?

 

[Emirzad]

Dr. Mason is still talking nonsense full of speculation. The guy who went to the Wikipedia page that has been stagnating for years to say the number of Kowsars built. The famous lack of money of the IRIAF is completely false, they are speculating because for me it is the opposite.

The IRIAF showed 3 assembly lines of the Kowsar, they are working to manufacture weapons for this plane. We saw an engine assembly line, we saw a new radar. The Kowsar is still evolving. Same for the Yasin, Qaher-313. Plus the improvements of the F-4, Mig-29, F-14 and more.

A lot of things are happening behind the scenes, the IRIAF is well funded and they are making a lot of progress. I will end up being right about people here who do not know how to think and observe. The rest will be exciting and revealing.

 

[alireza]

Problems with IRIAF in last 15-20 years are not the lack of Indigenous capability but it is the lack of money and commitment by leadership who were very interested in missiles, UCAVS, air-defense but not manned combat aviation.

- Kowsar/Azarakhsh-II is a thing of 2000s. An FCK-1 or F-20 type light fighter with strong avionics would have been good for 2000s-2010s if produced in targeted numbers but budget cuts ruined the program. I have already explained how lack of Yasin's induction (Kowsar's AT) points to Kowsar program finally biting the dust due to lack of $$$. 5 planes are flying, my guess is that they will show 1 odd squadron some years later and call it "Induction" like with Saeghe testbeds.

- Not sure what you are implying with F-14AM. I think the fleet is done considering the ratio of FMC airframes (~20)/number of available airframes (42 atleast). Maghsoud was supposed to be the ultimate ARH ECCM BVR for it with a thwarting range above 200+ KM but it vanished from exhibitions while Azarakhsh missile which was supposed to be a modern imaging All-aspect/HOBS WVR for F-14AM (like AIM-9X) is now a SAM. This tells us the lack of future for Tomcat fleet. Its hard to maintain old plane with HUGE RCS problem so it makes sense, but with cats gone and no SU-35+R-37 as of yet the long-range interception game is lost already. IAF can come close to the Iranian border to volley lofted ALBMs with no challenge, similarly Persian Gulf theatre is now the job of IADS with minimal IRIAF help.

- F-4E/D Dowran fleet is dedicated to maritime and land strikes, they have no A2A role assigned to them. The upgraded platform was supposed to have new A2A weaponry considering its new pulse Doppler radar by SAIRAN "Bayenaat-1" can track targets at 100+ KM (150 KM search range).

- MIG-29 9.12 without upgrade is a point defender at best. The plane has no ECM/ECCM, its relic N019 Sapfir 29 radar (derived from MIG-23ML) will be jammed from a distance and without datalinking its a sitting duck against modern fighters. Mind you the Iranian MIG fleet has never received even an ounce of avionics upgrade compared to AWG-9 of F-14A which was attempted to bring to APG-71 standard.

Mig-29 and Su24 upgrade to M/M2 standard would be great. I'm surprised that it has never been done yet. That would be a decent upgrade for IRIAF and it is probably much easier and more practical than trying to achieve the other upgrade plans/ideas.

 

[Emirzad]

Mig-29 and Su24 upgrade to M/M2 standard would be great. I'm surprised that it has never been done yet. That would be a decent upgrade for IRIAF and it is probably much easier and more practical than trying to achieve the other upgrade plans/ideas.

For years I had been in favor of just recreating IRIAF around MIG-29 infrastructure and a large fleet of ~120 airframes procured from wherever possible. MIG-29M/M2/SMT/K(MIG-35) with local RD-33 and R-77AE/73M licensed productions. Better than the crap fleet of Shahi relics. Iran under Rafsanjani asked for 72 airframes some 3 decades ago. Their good level of maintenance infrastructure and staff already exist inside Iran so they would have adapted quickly but IRIAF lacked leadership support and Russians have never been reliable with Iran.

 

[jauk]

For years I had been in favor of just recreating IRIAF around MIG-29 infrastructure and a large fleet of ~120 airframes procured from wherever possible. MIG-29M/M2/SMT/K(MIG-35) with local RD-33 and R-77AE/73M licensed productions. Better than the crap fleet of Shahi relics. Iran under Rafsanjani asked for 72 airframes some 3 decades ago. Their good level of maintenance infrastructure and staff already exist inside Iran so they would have adapted quickly but IRIAF lacked leadership support and Russians have never been reliable with Iran.

No. No conventional air force. Invest in drones and improve ordinance precision guidance, truck speed, stealth. Cheap is absolute king so getting shot down will force costs on opponent.

Their strategy is correct. There is no universe an Iranian indigenous conventional air force can compete with local and US ones technically or financially. Ever. Period. Spend that money on leapfrogging instead of never catching up--like they're doing now.

This stuff is simple folks.

 

[Emirzad]

No. No conventional air force. Invest in drones and improve ordinance precision guidance, truck speed, stealth. Cheap is absolute king so getting shot down will force costs on opponent.

Their strategy is correct. There is no universe an Iranian indigenous conventional air force can compete with local and US ones technically or financially. Ever. Period. Spend that money on leapfrogging instead of never catching up--like they're doing now.

This stuff is simple folks.

Except that Iran has no "cheap" drone that can challenge Israeli or even arab forces in the air or deliver "precision guidance" while being "stealth".

The intentional murder of IRIAF has now provided IAF the opportunity to roam freely over Iraqi airspace as we saw 4 months back. They can come in unthreatened, launch lofted ALBMs which no HIMADS in current Iranian service can engage. Radar sites and layered AD will be taken out. The same bases which may house prized possessions like S-300PMU2, F-14A/AM, SU-35S, Bavar-373, Mehran, AESA track radar or OTHs are defenseless unless Iran develops efficient most THAAD, or just invest in an airforce that can least thwart the enemy not to come closer to Iranian border. This is just one theatre, what about the Persian Gulf which has roughly 800 x 4/4+ generation fighters in the hands of enemies of Iran. These fighters can deliver SOWs out of the range of Iranian IADS to deplete the IADS we are so proud of while we will be sitting and taking it and our generals will be vowing "revenge" through statements. 15 years ago someone would have laughed at the idea of Israel freely assassinating Iranian-backed group leaders, freely bombing Lebanon, Syria, flying over Iraq, conducting assassinations, sabotages inside Iran. That all happened so while we can sit here and laugh at US backed sheikhdoms for now, nobody knows what kind of future we will be having with them. This argument that we can't fight USAF/USN so we should also open our legs for Israeli and Arab airforces is funny at best.