PAF Future Acquisition Plans

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

For all of Turkey's advancements, the TF-X program is not a true 5th gen.

No you're wrong KAAN is the true 5th gen jet, and please explain how KAAN is not 5th gen jet?

Are you talking about Korean KF-21 which currently is not 5th gen jet?

 

[hyperman]

No you're wrong KAAN is the true 5th gen jet, and please explain how KAAN is not 5th gen jet?

Are you talking about Korean KF-21 which currently is not 5th gen jet?

I can understand if he says supercruise, b/c KAAN is using 4th gen engines, with plans for 5th gen engines later down the road. But Fat Amy can't supercruise either. But in other aspects is a pretty capable fighter.

 

[MMM-E]

For all of Turkey's advancements, the TF-X program is not a true 5th gen.

KAAN is a 5th generation Fighter Jet project in terms of design , materials and technology.


KAAN will be 5 gen Fighter Jet with new turbofan Engine and with its features by 2033


1-- new turbofan Engine from TR-MOTOR for 5th gen capability
Supercruise ..... ( Supersonic flight without afterburner )

2-- with AI-enhanced battlefield awareness ( 360° situational awareness with 4 AESA radars - sensor fusion with EOTS , IRST with unique configuration )
3-- high-capacity networking , AI, data fusion

4-- Artificial Intelligence Co-pilot
KAAN will be autonomous .. The pilot can leave the task entirely to KAAN

5-- Pilot Health Tracking
if the Pilot faints , KAAN can return to the base and land on

6-- DIRCM Directed Infrared Countermeasure System by high power LASER
7-- HMDS (Helmet Display System) with AI-enhanced battlefield awareness
8 --Increased-range BVR Missile (GOKHAN ramjet powered long range networked a2a missile )
9-- excellent EW capabilities with ASELSAN FEWS -- Fighter Electronic Warfare Suite

10 -- full data-to-decision (D2D) capability for multi-layered distributed team of diverse manned aircraft working in concert with unmanned types ( KAAN , ANKA-3, KIZILELMA )

11-- internal weapon bay for stealth flight capability

12-- advanced stealth airframes and RAM paint

 

[ARMalik]

Engine life for one thing. Chinese metallurgy is not really up there.

What a load of BS. You have zero proof of what your saying. This is your personal opinion and personal opinions are NOT facts.

 

[VersusChristi]

What a load of BS. You have zero proof of what your saying. This is your personal opinion and personal opinions are NOT facts.

Pakistan's own airforce is getting JF-17 Block 3 powered by RD93MA instead of WS-13 because of the same reason. It is supposed to be "eventually replaced" by WS-13. China has yet to get its engines sorted out.

 

[MastanKhan]

A lot of this information is incorrect, for one thing, Turkey builds its own munitions, its not purchased from europe @MMM-E could tell you more about this.

Hi,

No doubt that Turkiye's quality is very good but most of Turkiye's top tier ammo are in different phases of development stage

 

[NGAD IS THE BEST]

Pakistan's own airforce is getting JF-17 Block 3 powered by RD93MA instead of WS-13 because of the same reason. It is supposed to be "eventually replaced" by WS-13. China has yet to get its engines sorted out.

They are just started and their engine life is improving significantly almost comparable to Russian engines if not ahead

Basic reasons for not selecting because if we select WS-13 than we need whole new logistics and maintenance systems was needed for WS-13 and somehow need to modify rear end of JF17 to fit WS-13

And remember we have well developed logistics and maintenance system for RD-93 that's why we were not chose WS-13

 

[enroger]

In a sense J-35 is more advanced than the J-20. For example it is designed in a time where large scale 3D printing of titanium alloy is available, so the entire midsection + wingbox is 3D printed monolithic piece, no welding is needed. I read in a paper this shaves off 20-30% structural weight while keeping the strength. If J-20 is to be switched to new production method the entire airframe needs to be redesigned.

A land based J-35 if it ever exist will have shorter wingspan and less strengthened landing gear and in general lighter airframe, we're not seeing it yet. Unless Pakistan is buying the naval variant as is (like Canada's F-18), it will take a few more years.

Personally I think Pakistan shouldn't rush 5th gen unless they perceive possible conflict in the near future, Pakistan's economy is in far more dire situation than it's security position IMO.

 

[MMM-E]

No doubt that Turkiye's quality is very good but most of Turkiye's top tier ammo are in different phases of development stage

Hi,

Turkiye has developed state of the art Missiles , long range guided munitions and Bombs

-- SOM-J stealth Cruise Missile ( 275 km , land attack/anti-ship )
-- CAKIR next gen mini Cruise Missile ( 150+ km , land attack/anti-ship )
-- HGK , KGK , LGK , NEB , TEBER , SARB guided Bombs
-- SDB , KUZGUN-SS and TOLUN long range guided munitions ( 100+ km )

-- BOZDOGAN WVR air to air Missile ( 25+ km )
-- GOKDOGAN BVR air to air Missile ( 100+ km )

also
-- KUZGUN-TJ joint strike Missile ( 180+ km with IIR or RF seeker )

We are waiting for AKBABA anti-radiation Missile
and GOKHAN ramjet powered long range air to air Missile


When KAAN enter service by 2028-2033 , Turkiye will not have any difficulties for ammunition

and now only Engine from the USA ( GE ) and ejection seat from the UK ( Martin Baker )
... rest of the KAAN is Turkish technology

Engine and ejection seat will be localized by Turkish companies to make the KAAN full of indigenous project by 2033

 

[MastanKhan]

Pakistan's own airforce is getting JF-17 Block 3 powered by RD93MA instead of WS-13 because of the same reason. It is supposed to be "eventually replaced" by WS-13. China has yet to get its engines sorted out.

Hi,

It is not for that reason---. Paf is extremely conservative in making a change or a transition from one machine to another---.

It is a firm believer that a time tested and a proven machine is better than a new machine---.

So far---Paf is extremely satisfied with the RD93 series---regardless of its shortcomings---because in war you need predictability---the RD93 is predictable---. In war you need your mechanics to maintain and make a quick turn around---. Paf's techs have over a decade of experience with the RD93---.

So---for the Paf---it would not be an easy switch---.

For all of Turkey's advancements, the TF-X program is not a true 5th gen.

Hi,

You are correct---. Tf-X will be a 4.5+++ gen aircraft.

Turkiye will have a 5th gen---but in time---.

 

[S10]

No you're wrong KAAN is the true 5th gen jet, and please explain how KAAN is not 5th gen jet?

Are you talking about Korean KF-21 which currently is not 5th gen jet?

I don't think it meets the Quad S requirements to truly be a 5th gen airframe, especially given its tiny proportions.

KAAN is a 5th generation Fighter Jet project in terms of design , materials and technology.


KAAN will be 5 gen Fighter Jet with new turbofan Engine and with its features by 2033


1-- new turbofan Engine from TR-MOTOR for 5th gen capability
Supercruise ..... ( Supersonic flight without afterburner )

2-- with AI-enhanced battlefield awareness ( 360° situational awareness with 4 AESA radars - sensor fusion with EOTS , IRST with unique configuration )
3-- high-capacity networking , AI, data fusion

4-- Artificial Intelligence Co-pilot
KAAN will be autonomous .. The pilot can leave the task entirely to KAAN

5-- Pilot Health Tracking
if the Pilot faints , KAAN can return to the base and land on

6-- DIRCM Directed Infrared Countermeasure System by high power LASER
7-- HMDS (Helmet Display System) with AI-enhanced battlefield awareness
8 --Increased-range BVR Missile (GOKHAN ramjet powered long range networked a2a missile )
9-- excellent EW capabilities with ASELSAN FEWS -- Fighter Electronic Warfare Suite

10 -- full data-to-decision (D2D) capability for multi-layered distributed team of diverse manned aircraft working in concert with unmanned types ( KAAN , ANKA-3, KIZILELMA )

11-- internal weapon bay for stealth flight capability

12-- advanced stealth airframes and RAM paint

It may eventually get there, but these capabilities are not present at the moment.

 

[VersusChristi]

They are just started and their engine life is improving significantly almost comparable to Russian engines if not ahead

I never claimed that China will never get there, just that its not there yet.

Basic reasons for not selecting because if we select WS-13 than we need whole new logistics and maintenance systems was needed for WS-13 and somehow need to modify rear end of JF17 to fit WS-13

And remember we have well developed logistics and maintenance system for RD-93 that's why we were not chose WS-13

Do you have any source for this? I ask because you will be having logistical burden due to new sensors and radar anyways. And not to mention, you will not get same RD93 engine as Block 2 as Block 3 uses an uprated variant of RD93 called RD93MA which produce quite a bit more thurst than Block 2 engine. So, yes, you will have to have logistical burden.

Hi,

It is not for that reason---. Paf is extremely conservative in making a change or a transition from one machine to another---.

It is a firm believer that a time tested and a proven machine is better than a new machine---.

So far---Paf is extremely satisfied with the RD93 series---regardless of its shortcomings---because in war you need predictability---the RD93 is predictable---. In war you need your mechanics to maintain and make a quick turn around---. Paf's techs have over a decade of experience with the RD93---.

So---for the Paf---it would not be an easy switch---.

Actually, JF-17 block 3 is substantially different machine than Block 2. It has new avionics, new engine (RD93MA with significantly uprated thurst), new weapon systems, sensors for MAWS to just name a few.

 

[MMM-E]

Hi,

You are correct---. Tf-X will be a 4.5+++ gen aircraft.

Turkiye will have a 5th gen---but in time---.

He is not correct
He said that the TF-X program is not a true 5th gen
He is correct if He say the first block of the TF-X will be not true 5th gen

TF-X is a 5th gen Fighter Jet project with new turbofan Engine by 2033
but TF-X block-1 will be 4+++ gen with American Engine in 2028

even in 2028
TF-X with American F-110-GE-129 Engine will be superior to Indian Air Force RAFALEs and SU-30 MKIs

İn 2030s TF-X will be 5th gen to match with Indian AMCA 5th gen Fighter Jet project


btw is J-31 a true 5th gen with WS-13 Engine ?

 

[MMM-E]

It may eventually get there, but these capabilities are not present at the moment.

Pakistan may buy TF-X in 2030s
and in 2030s KAAN ( TF-X ) will be 5 gen Fighter Jet with new turbofan Engine and with its features

I don't think it meets the Quad S requirements to truly be a 5th gen airframe, especially given its tiny proportions.

are you talking about KF-21 or TF-X ?

 

[S10]

Pakistan may buy TF-X in 2030s
and in 2030s KAAN ( TF-X ) will be 5 gen Fighter Jet with new turbofan Engine and with its features

Why would Pakistan buy TF-X in the 2030's when they can obtain these capabilities by next year with J-35? It would be redundant.

are you talking about KF-21 or TF-X ?

Both