The Munir Doctrine

[Signalian]

Same land with a border between them , but twice the yield .
Pakistan has plenty of scope to grow the yield, it can easily feed 40 crore population.

If military wants to intervene then why not intervene in property market instead of venturing into a new domain.


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34 Mound is 1200 ~kg.
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Let’s bring up a competitor for military, that’s the idea.

 

[Signalian]

I agree that it would best for our own universities and research institutions to be given the business to develop our own seed varieties, whose sole ownership would be in Pakistani hands.

Furthermore, ultimately, politicians come and politicians go, but kernel of the issue is focusing on solving the underlying issue, one way or another. If the domestic institutions were falling behind in tech, then they were not getting the funding or staff they need to make the breakthroughs.

Our crop yields are sub-par. The more we fall behind, the less competitive our agricultural products become. These agricultural products are the raw materials into other industries. So the effect is cascading. Ultimately in the video with Uzair comes the issue that if the Indian economy is 12x our size, that will be a national security threat in and of itself. So, we need a plan that can be implemented quickly and effectively.

The issue is not about giving up, but not about competing with each other in the domestic market, but working together to increase national exports.

It’s not just agri.

Military is ahead in R&D in most areas including military science and technology.

Which civil govt department is a shining example to be on par with military in terms of progression, technological advancement and can sustain itself in future for years to come. Name examples and we start discussing them.

 

[Signalian]

You want to invest in Pakistan? All economic indicators point towards an impending freefall.

You truly are brave!

Obviously, every Pakistani should who can afford to. Pakistan belongs to Pakistanis.

 

[Goenitz]

Supervisor ? Leader ?

Options - CEO, Minister, businessman, any other civil govt institution head….. who ?

considering the nature of one window operation, it means that SIFC is controlled by one 'supervisor'
I dont talk straight actually.

 

[Rego]

Obviously, every Pakistani should who can afford to. Pakistan belongs to Pakistanis.

Pakistan belongs to Pakistanis

Love your sense of humour!!

 

[Protagoras]

Chuloo bhar paani, if you are civvie.

That award is as worthless as the medals on that man's chest.

Only dungars would be impressed. Not surprising though with nothing else to show for.



Would be disappointed if IK also started flaunting how he recieved the highest civil award from a Middle Eastern despot.

 

[RescueRanger]

Politics won’t help. Research and development will definitely help. Entrepreneurial mindset too.

In Hectro Bolitho's biography of Jinnah, Bolitho recounts an exchange between the Quaid and young students. While advising students and youths to stay away from elements which spread hatred and despair.

The Quaid believed in objective and constructive politics.” He urged youths to follow in his footsteps, urging students to make the saying of the Quaid “work, work and work” as their motto, adding adopt the habit of studying.

 

[Goenitz]

@Rego
plz delete your thread, it has been in discussion already.

 

[FuturePAF]

It’s not just agri.

Military is ahead in R&D in most areas including military science and technology.

Which civil govt department is a shining example to be on par with military in terms of progression, technological advancement and can sustain itself in future for years to come. Name examples and we start discussing them.

That’s just it. There are currently no “civil government” companies capable of competing globally. “Civil government” companies have devolved into jobs programs more than profit motivated companies.

So let’s talk about the civilian private sector. The local non-governmental investors don’t feel they need to reinvest much in their companies. They are always asking for “relief” because the landscape is not conducive to investing in Pakistan. Many of these same investors go to Dubai or Bangladesh and set up shop there. Those places don’t give them “relief” but market rate services like anyone else.

There use to be a civilian company (probably among many) that was doing great before Bhutto’s nationalization. Zia even tried to reverse the nationalization, but this business owner never came back. Why did he never come back? why did someone else not take up from where he was forced out of, only a few short years later? Skilled people like him didn’t want the hassle of uncertainty, I assume, they figured if it could happen once it could happen again. I’m talking about BECO. The formerly number 1 company of Pakistan.

Nowadays, we have now are investors looking for ROI in quarters or by the end of the year, because the landscaper is uncertain, while before nationalization we had investors willing to invest for years, into the best equipment and the best talent to compete globally, and hope after years of investment their products would sell well, domestically but also internationally, akin to a new startup in Silicon Valley, that has done their R&D and found it globally competitive and brought their product to the world market.

The issue is not a military or civilian company doing better than the other domestically, but are either competitive by international standards. What is hold both back; the Civilian from reinvesting in his company or the military from doing joint ventures to acquire modern technology. In the military, the JF-17 was a joint venture that showed it can pay dividends. Had PAC gone down the LCA route, the PAF may still not have any JF-17s in service.

Joint ventures help leapfrog by acquiring advanced tech, and potentially open up an export market to supply, in full products or parts.

 

[Nilgiri]

but kernel of the issue is focusing on solving the underlying issue, one way or another.

But what is "the" underlying issue?

@That_Guy we may as well continue here regd the intersection of military and economy (i.e security vs sustenance w.r.t which order for donkey and cart etc).

 

[Oscar]

In Hectro Bolitho's biography of Jinnah, Bolitho recounts an exchange between the Quaid and young students. While advising students and youths to stay away from elements which spread hatred and despair.

The Quaid believed in objective and constructive politics.” He urged youths to follow in his footsteps, urging students to make the saying of the Quaid “work, work and work” as their motto, adding adopt the habit of studying.

That man has been unfortunately delegated to the paper notes he is now considered worthy of by most Pakistanis in terms of value. Everything else is just cultural rituals in terms of the sites, streets and holidays in his name.

 

[Goenitz]

Chuloo bhar paani, if you are civvie.

FF About Us

www.fauji.org.pk

See the board of directors.. All are civilians. Fauji Foundation was in huge losses for years even when they had no competition. They needed experts. Unfortunately, those are civvie.

The army can just cut the red tape and provide security. It can't do anything else. Even Suparco, AWC, etc have many civilians, who here given the right opportunities/tools do wonder.

Even putting army personnel in an underfunded and controlled civilian setup cannot give any yield. For example, martial law. Army had everything under command but couldn't develop any civilian setup.

In Ayub era, the westerners directly came and set up institutes like PTV, Steel Mills, etc For sure, there are/were some exceptions.

 

[RescueRanger]

That man has been unfortunately delegated to the paper notes he is now considered worthy of by most Pakistanis in terms of value. Everything else is just cultural rituals in terms of the sites, streets and holidays in his name.

Pretty much. But then again do have most of the other great people in our collective history.

 

[That_Guy]

But what is "the" underlying issue?

@That_Guy we may as well continue here regd the intersection of military and economy (i.e security vs sustenance w.r.t which order for donkey and cart etc).

The underlying issue facing Pakistan, at least the way I see it, is its political system.

It has caused instability since direct military dictatorship ended, and if analysts are to be believed, a hybrid system was introduced.

In such a system, the struggle for power is almost inevitable, and any minor disagreement will cause the delicate balance to break.

Unless and until this issue is resolved, Pakistan will continue to face political instability.

 

[FuturePAF]

FF About Us

www.fauji.org.pk

See the board of directors.. All are civilians. Fauji Foundation was in huge losses for years even when they had no competition. They needed experts. Unfortunately, those are civvie.

The army can just cut the red tape and provide security. It can't do anything else. Even Suparco, AWC, etc have many civilians, who here given the right opportunities/tools do wonder.

Even putting army personnel in an underfunded and controlled civilian setup cannot give any yield. For example, martial law. Army had everything under command but couldn't develop any civilian setup.

In Ayub era, the westerners directly came and set up institutes like PTV, Steel Mills, etc For sure, there are/were some exceptions.

Same with the strategic program. Top talent was recruited from the Diaspora.